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aaronk
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 1:03am | IP Logged
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I noticed that database doesn't list "45 version" for any CDs containing "She's Gone" by Hall & Oates. Instead, the comment "remixed 45 version" appears several times. What exactly is remixed on these versions? Did they correct the horrific edit on the horn solo in the middle, or is the entire song remixed? I don't own any of these CDs to verify.
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sriv94
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 8:05am | IP Logged
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Not sure what's remixed, but I do believe the "horrific edit" wasn't corrected.
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Grant
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 9:10am | IP Logged
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First, the 45 edit does appear on the Rock & Soul comp.
Second, from what i've ever been able to determine, the 45 was never remixed. It is the exact same mix as the LP. The LP master sounds a bit cleaner...
Third, i've never heard a bad edit on the horn part.
Perhaps Pat will tell us what he hears...
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jimct
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 9:41am | IP Logged
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aaronk wrote:
| Did they correct the horrific edit on the horn solo in the middle? |
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Now that you mention it, Aaron, that's what my friend Bob complained about on the RCA GH CD; he never claimed it was "remixed."
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aaronk
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 11:45am | IP Logged
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Grant, you are correct that the 45 is the same mix as the LP. But there IS an awful edit on the horn solo. It's right before the last verse; they tried to splice two different parts of the horn solo mid-note. The result is, as I stated above, horrific. Now, perhaps some of these "remixed" 45 versions fixed the terrible edit, although Doug claims they do not.
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sriv94
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 12:17pm | IP Logged
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The version on my iPod is the Rock 'N' Soul CD version. If we're talking about the same edit at the (2:00) mark, it does sound a bit clumsy.
I do have the T-L SotS: 1976 Take Two CD as well, but it's back at the house so I can't listen to that one right now to see if the edit is as bad (my guess is that it is). Those are the only CDs I have with the edited version.
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Grant
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 12:18pm | IP Logged
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Seriously, I never, ever noticed any bad edits! However, "remixed" is the wrong word to use here. "Re-edited" seems more appropriate.
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Grant
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 12:29pm | IP Logged
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OK, I cannot find the Time-Life CD I have the edited version on, but I do have the remastered "Rock & Soul" comp on Legacy/RCA. The edit is seamless, and it is the way I remember it on my Atlantic 45.
Edited by Grant on 13 June 2006 at 12:58pm
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Grant
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 12:58pm | IP Logged
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Now, i've just found my old Time-Life CD "1976: Take Two", mastered way back in 1991, and played the 45 edit of "She's Gone". Again, same as the remastered "Rock & Soul" CD, no bad edit! It is seamless.
I think we can lay this one to rest.
You have to admit, producer Arif Mardin did some very creative editing!
Listen again for yourselves.
I'll bet I could prove it again by digging up my old 45, but I don't have time.
Edited by Grant on 13 June 2006 at 1:40pm
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aaronk
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 3:46pm | IP Logged
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I just listened to Jim's copy of the 45, which identical to the copy my friend has. The edit is much choppier on the 45 than on the CD at the (2:00) mark. It sounds like they smoothed it out for the CD. If you listen to the 45, the horn is mostly in the left channel before the edit, and it gets louder and more centered after the edit. On the Rock & Soul CD version, the horn is still "choppy" sounding, but seems to stay more in the left channel before and after the edit & stay about the same volume.
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Pat Downey
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 6:41pm | IP Logged
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My notes on the cd "remixed" 45 version vs the vinyl 45 version indicate that on the 45, the high hat is very audible on the vinyl 45 but almost mixed completely out on the cd versions of the 45. Also there is an additional instrument mixed in on the cd versions at :29 to :30 (don't know what instrument that is - can anyone identify it?) that is not on the vinyl 45 at all.
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sriv94
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 7:07pm | IP Logged
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Not having the 45, I'm at a disadvantage, but are you talking about a synthesizer-like sound that goes up at (:29), with a lower one going down at (:31)?
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Gary Mack
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| Posted: 13 June 2006 at 7:31pm | IP Logged
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The bad edit on the promo 45 is quite noticeable on the stereo side, less so on the mono version, which is the way I often heard it at the time.
It sounds like a bad splice rather than an electronic edit. They chose to edit at the end of the last horn note, but there's a very short dropout there and the note trails off more to the right than when it started. Never noticed it before now when I completed a needle drop.
My dj copy is the first 1974 release on Atlantic 2993, whereas the hit came two years later on Atlantic 3332. Run time is 3:26, though the label says 3:24.
GM
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Grant
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| Posted: 14 June 2006 at 3:52pm | IP Logged
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It appears you guys are listening with headphones. I am not. That's why I never caught the L-R channel thing.
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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 19 September 2008 at 7:44pm | IP Logged
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OK, since this topic has come up on another forum, I finally found my commercial Atlantic 45.
1. I do not detect any difference between the CD and the 45 at the :29 - :30 second mark. There are no added instruments. However...
2) The saxophone blast on the first bridge before the the verse abruptly switches to the right slightly stronger like others have pointed out. The CD versions have had it smoothed out, either my remixing or compression. But...
3) The hi-hat on the intro sounds sloppy, but about the same relative volume as the CD versions do. This is why it is probably carefully remixed in the intro and at the saxophone blast.
Pat called it correctly!
Let's call this case closed!
BTW, the edit on the 45 does not bother me. I have made my own needle drop of it so I have a digital copy.
Edited by The Hits Man on 19 September 2008 at 7:46pm
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sriv94
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As the "bringer-upper" on that forum, thanks for digging your 45 out and getting to the bottom of this one, Grant.
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Gary Mack
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The Hits Man wrote:
OK, since this topic has come up on another forum, I finally found my commercial Atlantic 45.
1. I do not detect any difference between the CD and the 45 at the :29 - :30 second mark. There are no added instruments. However...
2) The saxophone blast on the first bridge before the the verse abruptly switches to the right slightly stronger like others have pointed out. The CD versions have had it smoothed out, either my remixing or compression. But...
3) The hi-hat on the intro sounds sloppy, but about the same relative volume as the CD versions do. This is why it is probably carefully remixed in the intro and at the saxophone blast.
Pat called it correctly!
Let's call this case closed!
BTW, the edit on the 45 does not bother me. I have made my own needle drop of it so I have a digital copy. |
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Which "commercial Atlantic 45" - the 1974 issue or 1976?
GM
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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 20 September 2008 at 9:26am | IP Logged
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1976
The runout groove: ST-A 27668-3 STA 27668-3 92961
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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 24 September 2008 at 7:33pm | IP Logged
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I know we talk about CD here, and Pat says the 45 is remixed. But, yesterday, I was out shopping for used vinyl, and decided to look for copies of this song on 45. Well, I bought one with a different number on the runout groove. This one I just bought says: ST-A 27668-3 STA 27668-4.
I played it and it sounds different. The sound is smoother, like the CD versions, but still has the hard edit at the horn part. Add to that, the 45 has a lot of bass, about a 17db rise at around 45Hz, and it's not compressed like version 3. Gee, I hope I don't find another copy that has the horn part smoothed over!
Anyway, I though you might like to know. I decided to not do a needle drop of it, and edited down the CD LP version to recreate the 45 edit. Then, I added that bass bump, but also added a bit of air. The edits are actually very easy to recreate, but the fade was troublesome, and I still don't have it perfect.
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Gary Mack
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| Posted: 25 September 2008 at 5:47am | IP Logged
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The Hits Man wrote:
1976
The runout groove: ST-A 27668-3 STA 27668-3 92961 |
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Hmmmm, the 1974 first release promo 45 is ST-A 27668-1 and, on the mono side, A 27668-1. Both labels list a 3:24 run time, but the stereo side is 3:26.
GM
Edited by Gary Mack on 25 September 2008 at 7:58pm
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Top 40 Music on Compact Disc : Chat Board
Topic: Hall & Oates - She’s Gone
