Indiana Wants Me
Printed From: Top 40 Music on CD
Category: Top 40 Music On Compact Disc
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Printed Date: 12 July 2025 at 9:10pm
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Topic: Indiana Wants Me
Posted By: Brian W.
Subject: Indiana Wants Me
Date Posted: 28 May 2006 at 9:57pm
|
Ed was kind enough to send me a dub of his short version 45, to try to recreate from the LP version.
Well, it's not possible... the vocals fade out in in the LP version and not the 45 version. I tried to dub in earlier parts of the song into that spot, but it doesn't work. So someone describe the long 45 version. Is it just an early fade of the LP version? |
Replies:
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 28 May 2006 at 10:07pm
| Given that the database comments read "LP version faded :12 early" for copies running (3:31), I'd say the 45 is not likely an early fade. |
Posted By: Todd Ireland
Date Posted: 29 May 2006 at 6:40am
|
I must say, there is perhaps no song with a more complex DJ and commercial single release history than R. Dean Taylor's "Indiana Wants Me". And the most irritating thing about it is that none of these single versions are available on CD!
Speaking of which, did the original LP release contain the song's sound effects in true stereo or electronically rechanneled stereo? |
Posted By: Bill Cahill
Date Posted: 30 May 2006 at 8:30pm
|
Here's everything I know about Indiana Wants Me, which is way too much.
There were two original single stock versions. Both mono. One with the siren at the beginning, one with the siren removed only on the intro. Different lengths. I don't know if there was a stereo promo 45. Motown was doing some of those around that time. It would be interesting to know if there was one. The album version sounds like it's in electronic stereo except for the sound effects which did go from channel to channel. Then to confuse matters further, sometime in the 1980's on the Motown Yesteryear 45 series issued a true stereo version with the vocal in the right channel. Very oddly mixed and no siren on the intro. But not all the Motown Yesteryear 45s have that stereo mix, you have to keep buying them until you find one and the time is wrong, it lists the album length. In the CD era, somebody decided that Electronic Stereo with stereo sound effects was a bad thing to release so many of the mono issues now on CD are actually the LP version converted to mono, but only the left channel, so the siren fades in and out wrong and the bullets firing are half missing. Anyone have anything else? |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 30 May 2006 at 10:09pm
| Bill, here's what I have: 2 different promo 45s: The first, on red vinyl, has a listed time of (3:35) on both sides, but both sides contain the same mono mix, with an actual running time of (3:01). (Deadwax D2-D2-D2-781M05, with 2 LENNY on it is well. This does NOT match up with the info on its label, which lists the other promo's info in error.) The second has a listed time of (2:19) on one side, and a listed time of (3:35) on the other. However, both sides are both EXACTLY the same, actual running time (3:35) mono mix. (Deadwax D2-P2-T2-717M11 with Z4KM-2133-1 stamped on both sides). I just listened to the first; then the second. Besides having the sirens chopped off the intro, the pitch on the (3:01) version is MUCH faster. Sounded like someone had placed a BRICK on my turntable when I played the (3:35) version - it was just SO much slower, by comparison. |
Posted By: Bill Cahill
Date Posted: 01 June 2006 at 7:05am
| Oh yeah! I forgot about the pitch difference! You're right! The stock 45 without the siren on the intro also runs faster. I believe the siren was removed for radio station play as they didn't want to scare people who were listening in car. |
Posted By: Gary Mack
Date Posted: 01 June 2006 at 5:09pm
|
May I muddy the water some more?
I have an original Rare Earth stock 45 with a label time of 2:53 that actually runs 3:01. Deadwax reads D2-D2-D2-781M05 followed by 8 Lenny. Guess what? No sirens, no gunshots, no efx whatsoever other than the cop on the bullhorn repeating three times, This is the police, you are surrounded, give yourself up over the end fade. I also have the promo stereo LP and the song is mono with siren panned left to right at both the beginning and the end. Label run time says 3:15. Seems to me that that was the true original version, but when the single started getting airplay, radio stations realized - ours (KRUX/Phoenix) was one of them - there was a serious problem. An FCC rule said stations could not broadcast a siren sound as an attention-getter. Uh-oh. Motown, not sure what to do, had producer Taylor remove the siren from the beginning, but he left it in at the end where it was thought to be obvious it was part of the record. But that only obscured the meaning of why he was wanted! The siren set the stage that the singer was on the run from the law. Meanwhile, Motown was losing momentum until a solution could be worked out. Poor Taylor! Stick to his art, or go along with Motown, which held the publishing rights? Eventually, all efx were removed and I do remember Motown notifying stations that the real official version was that one. A little of the preceding was, admittedly, my speculation but most of it is in my memory from 1970. GM |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 02 June 2006 at 2:39am
| Another quality, "Oh, Wow!" post, Mr. Mack. Now that you refreshed my memory, you are exactly correct about that FCC rule involving sirens - they didn't want drivers pulling over to the side of the road because of sfx on a song played on the radio. About your "8 Lenny" stock 45: 1) Did you guys at KRUX ever play that "no sfx" version on-air? 2) Did Motown/Rare Earth provide KRUX with that stock copy, or did you just happen upon it? A little weird that a "completely stripped, FCC sqeuaky clean for radio" no-sfx version, devoid of sirens/gunshots, may NOT have been issued as a promo? More searching to do - thanks again for the knowledge, Gary. |
Posted By: Gary Mack
Date Posted: 02 June 2006 at 8:09am
Actually, the FCC rule was written mostly to prevent advertisers from using sirens to attract attention, but it's worded in a way that could easily be applied to music or any non-news broadcast. Their concern was that listeners would likely be confused and possibly distracted by such tactics. As best I remember, KRUX played the promo mix that had the siren/shots only at the end. As soon as the clean version arrived, that's what we stayed with. I doubt very much that any promo issue had the clean mix, however, since by the time the problem was resolved, Motown had no need for promo copies - stock 45s with or without a sticker were sufficient. GM |
jimct wrote:Posted By: TomDiehl1
Date Posted: 14 September 2007 at 3:05am
|
Interestingly, the deadwax info on my shorter stock copy of the 45 matches up with what everyone else is saying, however it has "6 LENNY".
I've been reading a post on this song at the Both Sides Now forum and I find it interesting that the reissue 45, for a few copies, used the original mono 45 stamper for the long version (or at least the mono 45 version with the exact same deadwax info), but then at some point (i don't know if it was before or after) created a stereo mix using the short edit as a reference, and put that out on the reissue 45, with the label still listing the long version info but the deadwax only keeping the 711 in the number and changing the rest up a bit. I'd be curious to know what the deadwax info on the mono and stereo reissue 45s that some of you have says. All I have is the two stock 45s, long and short versions. ------------- Live in stereo. |
Posted By: eriejwg
Date Posted: 14 September 2007 at 10:05am
|
Discussion on this song fascinates me. I have the short dj version without sirens, gunfire etc in stereo. Gentleman, if you don't mind a couple questions...
1) Which version actually became the hit? The short dj version w/o sfx? The meaning of the song does lose its intent without the sirens etc. 2) The slowed down version with SFX. Was that the way it was released...or, was that on reissues? 3) Which version is played on oldies stations today? With or without sirens etc. But, I can't remember if it's slowed down dramatically like Jim's version. |
Posted By: TomDiehl1
Date Posted: 14 September 2007 at 9:37pm
|
Here's the thing....i hate calling one a short DJ version, because I have it on a stock 45, not a promo. My guess is the shorter one became the hit. But then I haven't heard the song on oldies radio in years, but only heard the long version on oldies radio.
Yes, the slowed down version with the sfx was on the first 45... ------------- Live in stereo. |
Posted By: BillCahill
Date Posted: 15 September 2007 at 7:34am
|
Here's what I have (with deadwax info)
Indiana Wants Me stock 45 3:35 length on label (correct), mono, siren on intro, no effects on fade out, D2-P2-T2 717MI on deadwax Indiana Wants Me stock 45 2:53 on label 3:01 actual runtime, mono, no siren on intro, two edits from the 3:35 version and an earlier fade, sped up compared to the 3:35, D2-D2-D2 781 MO5 Lenny on deadwax. Indiana Wants LP version, 3:15 on label 3:43 actual runtime, sped up even more than the 3:01 version, no edits compared to the 3:15 at least up until the ending which is a bit different, most of the song sounds like E with added reverb, but sound effects are stereo, like the siren and gunfire at the fade out. Gunfire was exclusive to this version, at least originally. Indiana Wants Me Yester Year 45 reissue: Same as 3:35 45, 3:35 label time (correct) Label number of Y 5491, mono, D2-P2-T2 717 M11 549-A on Deadwax. Indiana Wants Me Yester Year 45 reissue: (TRUE STEREO) 3:35 on label but matches the 3:01 version in edits, but is 3:02 and is true stereo. Also slightly faster than the mono 3:01 version but not as fast as the LP version. If you want to spot it by looking at it, the biggest difference I see is MOT 549 on label, not Y 5491, deadwax Y 5491- A D2 P2 D2 717 M11-13A FH-3H. Indiana Wants Me (on the CDs that I have checked) On the Rhino Have A Nice Day issue and the Rebound No. 1 Hits of the 70's it sounds like the LP version slowed down to match the 3:01 pitch. Oldies radio has most likely been playing the common CD issue. Speed on vinyl from slowest to fastest: 3:35 single (original and reissue) 3:01 single 3:02 true stereo single reissue 3:43 Lp version |
Posted By: eriejwg
Date Posted: 15 September 2007 at 8:50am
|
Thanks for the more than detailed info everybody. Was more curiosity than anything on my part.
Just for fun, checked the JonesTM site for what version is is their GoldDisc library. Run time is listed at 3:33 with a :25 intro. Obviously, the actual time would be 3:43, I'm guessing. And, the :25 intro leads me to believe that the talkup time is over the humming in the beginning. The song is not listed in their GoldWav library, which means it's not an active title on oldies stations that utilize JonesTM product. |
Posted By: TomDiehl1
Date Posted: 15 September 2007 at 9:35am
|
Bill, I actually timed my short 45 version out to 3:02. It did sound to me that the stereo reissue 45 did match it, but was probably edited some point well after the single had been made.
To confuse you a little....someone on the Both Sides Now website posted a picture of their 45 label for their stereo reissue 45 -- it has Y549F, on the label. The thread is here: http://www.websitetoolbox.com/tool/post/bsnpubs/vpost?id=214 0576 ------------- Live in stereo. |
Posted By: BillCahill
Date Posted: 15 September 2007 at 2:44pm
| When in doubt, use the trail wax I guess. |
Posted By: TallPaulInKy
Date Posted: 21 September 2007 at 3:15pm
|
I have a rare Earth R 5013 stock copy of Iniana Wants Me, which was purchased when the record was popular. It has a time of 2:53 on label, and actually runs that according to my timing. There is no siren on intro, but the siren comes in at 1:43, with sound effects at 2:33 (Policeman talking on a bull horn)
D2-D2-D2 781 MO5 6 Lenny on deadwax. I was a DJ in 1970 and this is also the version I remember playing. I thought the sirens and sound effects coming in late in the song, added to the dramatic tension. Never knew they originally had them in the front until many years later. |
Posted By: TomDiehl1
Date Posted: 21 September 2007 at 5:16pm
Can you re-time it? Your copy has the exact same trail-out information that mine has (right down to the 6Lenny), however mine runs about 3:02. I timed mine via digital using a Stanton Str8-80 turntable with pitch and speed control..... ------------- Live in stereo. |
Posted By: TomDiehl1
Date Posted: 27 September 2007 at 12:30pm
|
Paul sent me his copy of the single, in between the D2-D2-D2-781M05 and 6 LENNY is the number 10, which I don't remember seeing on my copy of the single (which is now misplaced at the moment). His copy played a bit cleaner than mine did and on my direct drive turntable it timed out to 3:02 (i was able to hear the runout to about half a second longer than i could on my own copy which is why i was not sure if i should post my 45 run time as 3:01 or 3:02, as mine has considerable groove wear). I think it is safe to say that there are only the two different 45 versions out there.
------------- Live in stereo. |
Posted By: Indy500
Date Posted: 21 June 2008 at 10:07am
|
Exciting news.
The Complete Motown Singles Volume 10: 1970 RELEASE DATE: June 27, 2008 Indiana Wants Me - R. Dean Taylor (Commercial Version) Indiana Wants Me - R. Dean Taylor (Promo Version) Maybe all our questions will be answered (for $120 of coarse) |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 21 June 2008 at 10:16am
| Indy, while you were posting, I was pre-ordering! Baesd on the first 9 volumes, they usually end up pushing back the actual release date by a week or two. Luckily, I live within 15 minutes of Hip-O Select's Shelton, CT headquarters, and as a result always get it within just a day or two of shipment, even using the "standard shipping" option. I will confirm the track listing info that Indy posted as soon as I get it. And FYI, the last two boxes, Volumes 11 & 12, for 1971 & 1972, should both be out, by this Aug/Sept & November, respectfully. |
Posted By: Todd Ireland
Date Posted: 21 June 2008 at 10:54am
| Great news indeed! I must admit, I had a sinking feeling "Indiana Wants Me" might get overlooked for this box set release given that R. Dean Taylor simply isn't a name synonymous with the Motown label. What a pleasant surprise to know the box set will contain both a promo and commercial 45 version! |
Posted By: Brian W.
Date Posted: 21 June 2008 at 12:18pm
Whee hoo! FINALLY! And coming out on my birthday, too -- happy birthday to me! :D It should be available to general retail in about two months, and Deep Discount only charges $100 for these sets with no tax and free shipping. But this particular volume, I don't know if I'm going to be able to wait for. (Actually, I take that back, since Hip-O charges $10 shipping on items over $100. Eesh!) |
Posted By: Brian W.
Date Posted: 21 June 2008 at 12:22pm
| Damn, too bad "Mama's Pearl" isn't on this one, though. I guess it'll on the next (final) volume. |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 21 June 2008 at 12:35pm
| You're way too young to know this, Todd, but R. (which stands for Richard, FYI) Dean Taylor was already a grizzled, behind-the-scenes veteran of the Motown operation by 1970. He had actually "ghost-written/produced" several of the company's big hit songs, my research has revealed, even though Motown would usually publicly credit one or more of their "marquee staff, name-brand" writers or production team, instead of him, strictly for marketing purposes. But Taylor was a loyal company man, however, and understood why. As such, he was allowed to "dabble" in the occasional, personal solo project when the studios were not in use. FYI, Taylor also happened to also the be the voice of "this is the police - give yourself up" on "Indiana Wants Me", did all of his own harmony, backup vocals, added all of the sound effects, and was, in fact, a one-man operation, on each and every production facet of his big hit. And, with the start of their Rare Earth subsidary, this proved to be the perfect Motown-related vehicle for the company to finally release his "side project". I agree though, Todd, I was also a little worried that they might overlook one of the various 45 versions for the 1970 box. I also might add that the first commercial stereo 45 issued on Motown was in 1969. It was "The Weight" by Diana Ross & The Supremes And The Temptations (which Pat has already, and quite impressively, noted in his database.) It also appears in stereo on the "Motown Singles Box, Vol. 9: 1969". And while I don't expect to find too many "stereo single versions" to surface on the upcoming 1970 Complete Motown Singles box (I've never heard any of the "Indiana Wants Me" 45 versions in stereo, for example), we should start to see at least a trickle of stereo 45 versions to appear on there, as some songs began to be originally mixed that way, on the 1970-1971-1972 boxes. |
Posted By: Brian W.
Date Posted: 22 June 2008 at 12:34pm
A bit off topic, but since we were talking about the "Complete Motown" series, a poster on the Steve Hoffman board claims the 1969 volume uses the wrong tape for "I'm Livin' in Shame":
http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=152264 Which led me to look up the song in the database, and, Pat, there appears to be a listing error. The notation at the top of the page says the 45 runs 3:05, yet the 3:06 versions in the listing have the note: "8 seconds longer than the 45 or LP." If the 3:05 running time is correct, the 2:57-2:58 versions should instead have a note that they are shorter than the 45. |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 22 June 2008 at 3:35pm
| Brian, I only posted about the newly-discovered "I'm Livin' In Shame" (3:05) actual run time info less than two weeks ago, on 6/9/08. This appears to simply be a case where Pat, who has recently added this new (3:05) database notation, simply forgot to quickly scan down the list of existing database CDs for the song, and delete/update any old notations, that I'm sure he'd long ago already entered, before my new information was posted, like that ":08 seconds longer than the 45 or LP" comment. I'm sure Pat will be correcting it shortly. |
Posted By: Brian W.
Date Posted: 22 June 2008 at 9:40pm
|
Hmm, I did do a search for it, and came up with nothing.
I just tried it again, and what happened is the word "livin'" has a "smart quote" curved asterisk on your posting, and but the font I'm using just has a straight up and down asterisk, so the search engine didn't find it. Pat, maybe your programmer can put that on his "to-do" list for sometime in the future -- for the search feature to ignore punctuation. Try it... cut and paste the new Harold Melvin "If You Don't Know Me" thread title (not from here, from the actual thread title) and paste it in the search field and press "search." It comes up with nothing found. |
Posted By: TomDiehl1
Date Posted: 24 June 2008 at 11:54pm
|
Seeing how there are confirmed two different pressings of Indiana Wants Me on 45, i'm curious as to which one will be called the promo version and which one will be called the commercial version, and whether either of those is accurate or not. Also, the short 45 version does exist in stereo on a reissue 45 as noted elsewhere on this board.... ------------- Live in stereo. |
Posted By: sriv94
Date Posted: 25 June 2008 at 7:07am
It wouldn't be the final if they're going to 1972 ("Mama's Pearl" was a hit in 1971). ------------- Doug --------------- All of the good signatures have been taken. |
Posted By: Brian W.
Date Posted: 25 June 2008 at 10:53am
Yeah, I think I misspoke on that. I think they are going to 1972. So there should be two more volumes after this. |
Posted By: Brian W.
Date Posted: 25 June 2008 at 10:54am
I'm wondering about the mislabeling, too, since there short version was not just a "promo." |
Posted By: Paul C
Date Posted: 27 June 2008 at 11:41am
My copy of the Motown "Yesteryear Series" re-issue 45 is in stereo (and not just the sound effects). The label states the time as (3:35) but it actually runs (3:01). After a by no means thorough comparison between it and my copy of the original (3:01) 45 (which is mono), I can't detect a difference. Unfortunately this series, especially the stereo recordings, has horrible sound quality. I recall reading a letter to the editor in Billboard in the late 1980's in which a dealer stated he would no longer stock Motown re-issue 45s after receiving numerous complaints. Among the songs Taylor claims to have co-written are "Standing in the Shadows of Love" and "Love Is Here and Now You're Gone". |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 27 June 2008 at 12:08pm
| I should've clarified my above comment - I, too, have that stereo 45 re-issue - I'll have to pull it from storage. I just don't personally believe in referring to such re-issues when reporting to the Board, but I can certainly see where the contents of those could be of value/interest, like with Andy's recent post about his excellent-sounding "I Believe" stereo re-issue 45. I was also pleasantly surprised to read Paul C's comment about his re-issue 45's stereo separation not being limited to the sound effects, which was my recollection as well. In other news, I happily just received e-mail notification from Hip-O Select that my 1970 Motown Singles Box was shipped today, right on time, on its scheduled 6/27 release date, so I will be able to shortly and fully report on the mono/stereo status of "Indiana Wants Me" on there. |
Posted By: Indy500
Date Posted: 28 June 2008 at 4:57am
|
I gave my set a quick listen.
The promo is 3:02 or so and the commercial is 3:34. Both are mono. The promo doesn't mix the opening effects out, it just edits the first 8 seconds or so. Hopefully someone can fill in some more details. Set looks and sounds fantastic. |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 28 June 2008 at 10:47am
| Indy500, based on your nickname I certainly know you can get from "Point A" to "Point B" in a big hurry. But I have no idea, unless you work for Hip-O Select, how you can already have in your possession a "mail-order-only, not-available-in-stores" 6-CD set, the same DAY it is released and mailed out? I've even made the short drive to Hip-O Select headquarters myself, and they outright refused to me simply hand me a pre-ordered, previous Motown Singles Box Volume. All product shipped by mail only, they told me. But since you somehow do already have Volume 10, can I just bypass Hip-O Select entirely, and simply order Volumes 11 & 12 through you instead????? :) |
Posted By: Indy500
Date Posted: 28 June 2008 at 2:58pm
|
Well, this is the volume I've been waiting for so I did get the 2 day shipping.
And according to the liner notes, Taylor is not the voice of "This is the police," but that it's Don Gooch, a recording engineer and part-time trombone player. |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 28 June 2008 at 4:18pm
| They still must've two-day shipped it to you before Friday, Indy, because it's still just Saturday; only ONE day later than the 6/27 release date! :) And great job on the Don Gooch "this is the police" correction. I got the "R. Dean was the police voice" from a normally-reliable reference book, but the liner notes on these Motown Singles Boxes have proven to be nothing short of incredibly insightful, so I stand corrected! |
Posted By: Indy500
Date Posted: 29 June 2008 at 5:06am
|
I think my email notice was received Thur Am, so yeah, they must have shipped it Wed. I was just wanting it next week so I was pleasantly surprised to trip over it Friday afternoon on my way to work.
The track after "Indiana" is "Come On People" by The Rustix (also produced By R Dean Taylor) and how it wasn't a hit in the summer of 1970 is beyond me. Great lost track. Hope yours arrives Monday. |
Posted By: sriv94
Date Posted: 01 July 2008 at 6:42pm
|
I was excited to hear the news about the 1970 singles box being released, but it completely slipped my mind that iTunes got 1967, 1968 and 1969 about six to eight weeks later than retail. Oh well. . .I've waited this long, might as well wait a few weeks longer. ------------- Doug --------------- All of the good signatures have been taken. |
Posted By: Brian W.
Date Posted: 07 July 2008 at 8:37pm
| Jim, have you received Vol. 10 of "Complete Motown Singles" yet? I was hoping for a more detailed post on "Indiana Wants Me" to add to what Indy500 began. |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 07 July 2008 at 11:10pm
| Brian, I also got a PM from someone else on the Board, asking me to expound on my "Indiana Wants Me" observations, so I will. I didn't forget - I simply agreed 100% with all of Indy500's findings for the song, so I didn't believe I had anything new to add. But, for the record, exactly like my promo 45 "short version" does, the promo version included on the Motown Singles 1970 Box simply cuts off the opening :08 or so siren intro. As for the commercial 45 version on the 1970 Motown Singles Box, it also matches my 1970 commercial 45, so we FINALLY have a CD version that runs long enough, in the (3:34-3:35) time range, like the commercial 45 does. Both of my original 45 versions, and both of the "Indiana Wants Me" 1970 Motown Singles Box versions, as Indy500 earlier stated, are in mono. |
Posted By: TomDiehl1
Date Posted: 08 July 2008 at 12:38am
|
Ok so to clarify.....
We now have the long 45 version on cd, and now also the short 45 version (call it a promo version if you must but it exists on stock copies too).... right ? Orrrr is there a 3rd version available on the promo 45 that was on neither of the stock variations.... ------------- Live in stereo. |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 08 July 2008 at 1:29am
| Sorry to be fuzzy, Tom. This song's long post history has just required me to re-read things, to "catch back up again" on everything. As an added detail, the "short version" (on promo, stock, whatever you happen to own) on the 1970 Motown Singles Box also runs (3:01), just like the short version 45 does. So, aside from the "stereo short 45 version", that appears on some re-issue 45's and is still not on any CD, I am very confident in stating that both of the 1970 mono 45 versions are correctly included on the 1970 box. For what's it's worth, though, Tom, the track listing DOES refer to the short version as the "promo version", which I know you happen to have on a commercial 45. The longer, (3:35) version is described in the 1970 box track listings as the "commercial version." |
Posted By: Brian W.
Date Posted: 08 July 2008 at 1:43am
|
Thanks, Jim. Very good news that these are both finally on CD, in their correct 45 versions; probably my most-wanted song on this entire set. (Second is the mono "Mama's Pearl," coming on Vol. 11.)
I'm just getting myself caught up on my buying of these sets. Vols. 8 and 9 both came in the mail today, and I ordered 7 and 2 this evening. Vol. 7 is temporarily out of stock at CD Universe, and may not ship for a few days. I already owned 3 through 6. By the way, for anyone who bought the 1965 volume with the incorrect tape used for "Shotgun," Hip-O offered (still does??) a replacement disc. I bought mine quite a while after release, and mine came packaged with the corrected disc. Not that it was a big deal -- the correct mono 45 version is available on numerous CDs. |
Posted By: Indy500
Date Posted: 18 July 2008 at 11:47am
|
For information purposes.
Listening to a Sept 1970 American Top 40 show, they used the promo version. |
Posted By: Yah Shure
Date Posted: 19 July 2008 at 7:35am
|
Much of this info has already been posted, but perhaps a little visual reference can help. Here are scans for what I have. I timed these from very beginning to very end of audio.
The promo copy is identical on both sides - listed 3:35/3:35 mono/mono. Deadwax: D2-P2-T2-717M11 (which varies slightly from the printed matrix number.) Also contains machine-stamped Z4KM-2133-1. Slower pitch than the other two pictured. Actual time is (3:37). Commercial copy, listed (2:53), deadwax: D2-D2-D2-781M05, then a 10 followed by 6LENNY. Lots of space between the 10 and the other info. Actual time is (3:02). LP version listed (3:15), actual time is (3:42). Yikes! Even the matrix numbers are confusing! 
|
Posted By: Brian W.
Date Posted: 21 July 2008 at 6:43pm
| Lovely scans, Yah Shure. Thanks. |
Posted By: sriv94
Date Posted: 12 August 2008 at 9:40am
|
Just a note for those inclined--iTunes now has the 1970 singles set. I had never heard the commercial 45 for "Indiana Wants Me" before (I do have an MP3 of the promo)--that was cool. Also nice to have the single versions of Diana Ross' "Remember Me" and the Four Tops' version of "It's All In The Game." ------------- Doug --------------- All of the good signatures have been taken. |
Posted By: eriejwg
Date Posted: 12 August 2008 at 9:53am
| It's also now on Napster, too. |
Posted By: Brian W.
Date Posted: 12 August 2008 at 11:49am
|
It's available at regular retail now, too. It hasn't been loaded on MusicGiants yet, but it should be soon... all the other sets are there. Sometimes their street dates are different than the regular download sites.
I was listening to the song samples on iTunes last night, and was thrilled to see something I hadn't noticed before: there are two mono promo versions for Diana Ross's "Ain't No Mountain High Enough." One appears to be the full length LP version, mixed to mono, but the other is a 4:05 radio edit that has never before appeared on CD. Of course, the 3:30 45 version is also included. |
Posted By: Hykker
Date Posted: 12 August 2008 at 5:33pm
Curiously, what's the difference between the 4:05 version and the commercial single? I don't have the promo single of this, but I don't recall the short version played on the radio as being any different than the stock 45. |
Posted By: Bill Cahill
Date Posted: 12 August 2008 at 6:04pm
| I just listened to the 4:05 edit via Rhapsody (subscription service) I haven't heard this edit before, it matches the single up until the end when there is a slightly different edit on the instrumental break and a much longer fade out. It does not contain the line "one more time" which is exclusive to the commerical single. |
Posted By: Yah Shure
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 1:02pm
I didn't previously realize that I had the stereo reissue, so I gave it a belated spin: 
Deadwax differs slightly from Bill's copy: Y549F-A-D2-P2-D2-717M11-13A FH-3H Many of us know about Motown's typically awful pressing quality. Well, this one creates a new, sub-sub basement level. The mastering job on the flipside, "Gotta See Jane", is of early-'70s vintage, but "Indiana" was freshly-mastered on my mid-'80s reissue. The entire "Indiana" playing surface is covered with hairline cracks that resemble a marble surface, whereas "Jane" is much smoother. There's a large lump of recycled plastic in the aggregate that produces a noticeable thump toward the song's end. Once the needle hits the fan... er, record, it gets interesting. To confirm what Bill mentioned earlier, this is, indeed, an odd-sounding mix. I verified channel connections using a Shure test record, and R. Dean's vocal is entirely in the left channel. The siren SFX in the bridge do not pan back and forth like they do on the LP version; here, they are entirely in the right channel. This is a very wide mix, and about the only things that are centered between the channels are the punctuating strings that follow the line, "I wish I had you to talk to." On the mono 45, these strings are mixed more toward the background, but here, they are quite a bit louder. Not that the song's sound quality was ever really stellar, but on this stereo reissue, there is a very high amount of distortion on Taylor's vocals; much more so than on the mono 45s. Tnink I'll stick with the (M) and (E) versions of this one. |
Posted By: bwolfe
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 1:27pm
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Motown was notorious for bad vinyl.
I have that same single and its horrendous. The local record store folks replaced two Lionel Richie "Can't Slow Down" albums until we found a decent one. The three album Temptations "Anthology" I gave away. I heard Motown even recycled the lables. Most used to cut the labels out before recycling. Take a look at some of your Motown singles from the 80's. ------------- the way it was heard on the radio |
Posted By: eriejwg
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 5:08pm
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That's why I always seek out Motown promo copies, when possible.
One example I remember, in radio in 1980, the beautiful intro to the Billy Preston & Syreeta track, "With You I'm Born Again." The stock copy sounded like someone had an open mic nearby popping popcorn. Horrendous. Luckily, even though a small station, we were serviced with promo copies. Quiet intros like that on Motown, with engineers tuning Optimod's as they felt sounded best, could really bring surface noise out. Don't know about any of you radio folk back then, but we didn't clean each 45 before cueing and playing. |
Posted By: Hykker
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 5:25pm
Probably the worst case I ever ran into was Diana Ross' "Theme From Mahogany". PD told me he went thru 5 copies before he found one clean enough to cart. Gotta say though, I've never seen a Motown 45 get cueburn. |
Posted By: sriv94
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 5:45pm
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Sorry to threadjack, but here's a question (since the only radio station I ever spent considerable time in was all carts back then and I didn't spend much time with the music director).
When record labels issued copies to radio stations who actually played the vinyl (or even used it for carting), did they generally service only one copy and if a record became unplayable for whatever reason it was incumbent on the station to request additional copies? Or did they service multiple copies, just in case? ------------- Doug --------------- All of the good signatures have been taken. |
Posted By: eriejwg
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 5:51pm
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Don't worry, a few of us are guilty of threadjacking... look up the definition, you'll see our pictures...
Anyways, the stations I worked at that got record service usually got 3 copies or so of a 45. By 1981, late by many standards, was the first time I worked at a station that had carted music. But, I know some locally that had carted music as early as 1975 and 1976. |
Posted By: eriejwg
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 5:55pm
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To add to my post, usually the jocks in smaller markets played the vinyl themselves and ran their own boards, unlike the big union stations like CKLW, WLS and the like.
Usually, the station's Music Director was responsible for carting up the music. I even remember working at a couple stations where the Music Director wound carts from scratch. I remember doing that too. I seem to recall this winding unit had a stopwatch on it so you knew the exact length to wind it for a song. |
Posted By: sriv94
Date Posted: 29 October 2008 at 6:01pm
Just FYI, WLS went to all carts somewhere around 1970 or 1971 (ABC reached an accord with I believe NABET to allow DJs to run their own boards and use carts for music instead of having a record turner cueing the records in studio). I'm not sure if CKLW ever went to cart or not--I seem to recall seeing a photo from the early 1980s in which multiple turntables were visible in the studio. ------------- Doug --------------- All of the good signatures have been taken. |
Posted By: Hykker
Date Posted: 30 October 2008 at 6:00am
Maybe in Chicago, but I don't think all ABC stations implemented this. I've seen late-70s photos of WABC, and it appears that they still used used board-ops. Speaking of WABC & carts, didn't they start playing music from carts in the mid-60s? While he wasn't specific on dates, this was implied in Rick Sklar's book Rockin' America. |
Posted By: Yah Shure
Date Posted: 30 October 2008 at 8:05am
A station's reporting status and/or its ability to sell records largely determined the level of record service it received. Small market stations which developed reputations for breaking records were also well-serviced in the days before tier reporting took hold. In a case like "Indiana Wants Me", important stations received copies both directly from Motown and from independent distributors. This sometimes resulted in a given station receiving multiple promo copies from different pressing plants. When I worked at Heilicher Brothers in Minneapolis during the mid-'70s, we typically were not sent enough promo 45s to service all of the format-applicable radio stations within our large geographical region. The pecking order was the reporters, first, the secondary, non-reporting stations last. The problem was that the secondary stations weren't already getting copies directly from Motown, so if the allotted copies ran about before their turn, they went without product (or relied on RSI or local sources) while the bigger stations ended up with multiple copies. But to the labels and the distributors, selling records was the ultimate purpose of the promo 45s, so they were sent to where they were most likely to make the most sales, or to get the crucial adds on radio. It didn't matter whether or not the stations played vinyl or carts on the air; ensuring that the important stations had the records was what mattered. The worst all-time offender that I recall was Linda Ronstadt's "(She's A) Very Lovely Woman" Capitol 45 (#70, 1971.) Even the few stations I heard it on were stuck with crackle-infested copies. I've often wondered whether or not the record's chart fate may have been hindered due to its extremely poor pressing quality. |
Posted By: sriv94
Date Posted: 30 October 2008 at 8:37am
Could be on WABC--I'm not sure. I'm going by Clark Weber's book Rock And Roll Radio: The Fun Years (1955-1975), in which there were numerous photos of WLS' air studio circa 1967 in which turntables with records on them were in full view. Weber told me at a book signing recently that carts weren't put into use for music until around 1970 primarily because of union rules--and there is a brief blurb in the book about it but it's somewhat clumsily written. (Although Weber had left WLS by 1968.) ------------- Doug --------------- All of the good signatures have been taken. |
Posted By: edtop40
Date Posted: 30 October 2008 at 9:10pm
my commercial 45 which has a different pressing font than yah shure's...
 ------------- edtop40 |