the animals house of the rising sun
Printed From: Top 40 Music on CD
Category: Top 40 Music On Compact Disc
Forum Name: Chat Board
Forum Description: Chat away but please observe the chat board rules
URL: https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=8556
Printed Date: 11 May 2025 at 4:32pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.07 - https://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: the animals house of the rising sun
Posted By: edtop40
Subject: the animals house of the rising sun
Date Posted: 10 May 2016 at 2:45pm
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my commercial 45 for the animals song 'the house of the
rising sun' issued as mgm 13264 lists a run time on the label as 2:58 but actually runs 3:01...the run out groove info is 'K 13264 64-xy645'....i post this because the db states that the run time of the 45 is 2:58....can anyone else confirm their commercial 45's run time? ------------- edtop40 |
Replies:
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 11 May 2016 at 1:18pm
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Ed, I own 3 commercial copies of the MGM 13264 45, and my cleanest
copy exactly mimics your deadwax info. The reason I never reported my timing results during my 1964 db songs 45 research sweep (listed 2:58; actual 3:00) a while back is that the :02 difference I found didn't meet Pat's longstanding reporting policy of a minimum of a :03 second difference. But after 10 years + of being here on the board with you, good buddy, I know very well that you're not at all a fan of this policy of Pat's, and have always basically ignored it. To each his own, I say! As for me, I've always tried to keep my personal opinion on the issue 100% out of it, and simply abide by Pat's policy on Pat's forum. Ed, I will grant you that my actual 45 timing *almost* reaches (3:01), but both my old Post-It Note and new re-timing for you today both came out to (3:00.8). Man, the word "truncated" doesn't seem nearly adequate enough to describe this 45's fade. The first evidence I could hear for the start of the fade was at the (2:56) mark. From there, the remaining (:04) seconds of the fade is way too quick and severe, hurts my ears, and can only be described as being extremely poorly done. But that's besides the point. Neither of my other two stock 45 copies (deadwax info of "K13264 64 XY 645-5" and "K13264 64 XY 645-8") quite got to the (3:01) mark, either. They came out at (3:00.8) and (3:00.9), respectively. |
Posted By: MMathews
Date Posted: 11 May 2016 at 9:49pm
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Interesting. My own dub of our stock copy times at
exactly (2:59.5). I don't have the 45 handy, but I'll get the deadwax# at work tomorrow. Jim, I thought that :03 sec policy was in regard to database entries, not the chat board. I don't recall clearly tho, it's been years! I feel ya about this 45's abrupt fade, but for me that's great as compared to the first 2 edits. Those hurt my ears much worse. Since this was such a monster hit, I'd assume there were several pressings of this during its chart run and I'll bet there are small differences in pitch causing these slight time differences. MM |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 11 May 2016 at 10:18pm
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Yes, Mark, you're 100% correct about the :03 second policy being in
regard to db entries, not the chat board. But the primary reason I either start or respond to existing threads with timing details is because I've noticed that Pat's db has no current timing notation attached to it, and I have discovered that my copy's listed/actual timing details meet his :03 reporting criteria. For many years Pat has kindly added my details to his db. While there are surely some forum readers that have interest in :01 & :02 second L/A differences, I know others who have no interest in them at all. Therefore, I've always been mindful of not "inundating" the forum with the very large # of these smaller time differences - especially if Pat isn't going to note the info in his db. That was my reason for bringing that point up in the first place, in response to Ed. So he would know why I hadn't started a song thread for it years ago. |
Posted By: Jody Thornton
Date Posted: 01 January 2018 at 8:06pm
So wait for just a sec. At this moment, I'm listening to that old "24 Electryfying Hits" compilation LP from 1970, which has an abrupt sounding edit of this song on it. Is that edit for real? The intro, keyboard solo and the ending all have edits. And there appears to be some heavy wow and flutter on the tape master. ***** Edit **** I just went and listened to a YouTube vid of the 45-rpm disc. Ouch - that's awful, but still a different edit than I just listened to on the turntable. http://www.mkvirtual.com/Collectible/Records/Rock_LP_details /Compilation/24_electrifying_hits-Various_artists.html - House of the Rising Sun (Edited) ------------- Cheers, Jody Thornton (Richmond Hill, Ontario) |
MMathews wrote:Posted By: KentT
Date Posted: 03 February 2018 at 6:47am
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This tune in the USA version was edited so severely, I
suspect a Stihl Farm Boss Chainsaw was used. When that British Hits comp on MGM was issued, hearing the full version was a major epiphany. ------------- I turn up the good and turn down the bad! |
Posted By: Tom Daly
Date Posted: 06 March 2018 at 6:10pm
| Having worked in the industry, playing time of analog recordings can vary widely, especially when we're talking about the drive systems that were used in analog tape machines of the day with A/C synchronous motors and variations in line frequency. Add to the mix that "House of the Rising Sun" was recorded in the UK on 50 Hz tape machines. The UK tapes wouldn't play at exactly the same speed on US decks due to our use of 60 Hz synchronous motors. There would always be tiny variations, even between two decks of the same make and model in the same country! Given that, and that synchronous A/C motors were also what was common until Japanese turntables, both belt and direct drive switched to using DC servo controlled motors and eventually quartz locked PLL drive systems in the best turntables, any record would play for one length on one turntable and be off by a few seconds on another. Today, playing times are generally calculated by the time of a song's file used to make a CD master, including the silence before and after the song. On anything I've ever mastered, take the length of the entire track, subtract :03 and you have the exact playing time of the recording. A :03 difference between label time and actual playing time is inconsequential to most of us, however if you REALLY want to discuss label errors, I recommend starting with the Philles single of "You've Lost That Lovin' Feelin', which most certainly does NOT play for 3:15! |
Posted By: Edoz
Date Posted: 16 January 2021 at 12:45pm
| If all of the versions of HOTRS on CD are the full length album version and the edited US single is not available on CD, then why are the appearances listed in Pat's database not flagged as "album version?" |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 16 January 2021 at 2:39pm
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I think those were labeled in the database at one point, so I’m not sure
why Pat removed them. To clarify, though, the original vinyl LP and 45 are the same, and both have the edited version. The longer version is technically originally from the Greatest Hits LP. ------------- Aaron Kannowski http://www.uptownsound.com" rel="nofollow - Uptown Sound http://www.919thepeak.com" rel="nofollow - 91.9 The Peak - Classic Hip Hop |
Posted By: Edoz
Date Posted: 16 January 2021 at 4:17pm
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yes...that's so (as you know).
Even though the US edit is crappy, it would be nice to have it on at least one CD reissue for history's sake. |
Posted By: AndrewChouffi
Date Posted: 16 January 2021 at 5:55pm
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Yes, all I knew was the US edit; as a
young kid it was a great 3 minute record. A year or so later I rifled through my cousin's albums and noticed some Mickie Most various artists LP with containing the "original uncut version" of "Rising Sun" - My mind was totally blown as it it was the first time I had ever heard it! Andy |
Posted By: Pat Downey
Date Posted: 16 January 2021 at 7:56pm
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Regarding the "LP version" of House Of The Rising Sun, the
parent LP in the US for this song was titled "The Animals" and on that LP the song runs (3:00) just like the 45 so there is no 45 or LP designation. As Aaron has pointed out, the longer version first appeared on the Animals Greatest Hits vinyl LP and in my opinion should not be considered an LP version. That information is included in the database under the song title description. |
Posted By: Edoz
Date Posted: 17 January 2021 at 12:19pm
| Thanks, Pat. |
Posted By: Yah Shure
Date Posted: 17 January 2021 at 5:50pm
Pat is correct about The Animals being the U.S. parent LP, and I bring this up merely as a point of clarification: our late friend Gary Mack pointed out in an unrelated 2010 thread that the first U.S. appearance of the unedited "House Of The Rising Sun" came five months prior to its inclusion on MGM's 1966 The Best Of The Animals LP (E/SE-4324):
This is the same LP Andy was referring to above, with its "original uncut version" wording. A couple of commenters on the Mickie Most album's discogs listing claim that the record actually plays the 3:00 single version, but I have a copy of the mono edition and can verify that it does play the full 4:29 version, as stated on the album cover and the record label. |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 17 January 2021 at 6:07pm
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Excellent info, John! Thanks! ------------- Aaron Kannowski http://www.uptownsound.com" rel="nofollow - Uptown Sound http://www.919thepeak.com" rel="nofollow - 91.9 The Peak - Classic Hip Hop |
Posted By: KentT
Date Posted: 22 January 2021 at 11:36am
Note too, very soon after the MGM version of Mickie Most Presents British Go-Go, the LP was reissued on MGM's Metro Budget Label, as M/MS 577 released in 1966. The Metro LP is much more common than the MGM LP of same. ------------- I turn up the good and turn down the bad! |
Posted By: crapfromthepast
Date Posted: 10 May 2025 at 7:14pm
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I was thinking about posting editing instructions to recreate the 45 from the full performance, but I don't think I can adequately describe how to do so without letting you hear the final product. If you followed any kind of instructions accurately and listened to the edits, you would think that you're clearly doing something wrong. It didn't bother the engineer at MGM, though. In the 45 version, there are edits at 1:43 (in between beats, goes into keyboard solo), 1:55 (careens from keyboard solo into vocals in next verse), 2:29 (at end of word "well"; vocals work well but the edit keeps an extra beat of the song and throws off the rest of the instrumentation - it's just like the Jonathan and Darlene Edwards records!), and an early fade. From the point of view of someone who likes to make edits as seamless as possible, it's *AMAZING*. Also, the full unedited performance seems to have been the UK 45 version, which was released well before the LPs listed above. The US got the severely edited version on both the 45 and LP, and only got the unedited performance well after the song was a hit. ------------- There's a lot of crap on the radio, but there's only one http://www.crapfromthepast.com" rel="nofollow - Crap From The Past . |