America - "Tin Man" - Top 40 Music on CD Forum

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Roscoe

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Topic: America - "Tin Man"
Posted: 21 June 2010 at 6:06pm

I couldn't find any previous thread or a database
notation on the song "Tin Man" by America, but I think
there may be a 45 vs. LP difference. On the LP, some
instrumentation from the outro of the previous track is
cross-faded on the first 2.9 seconds of "Tin Man".

Unfortunately, I don't have a 45 to compare to but I
assume the 45 starts with a clean intro without the
cross-fade. I only have this song on a couple of other
CDs and can report the following:
Time-Life SOD-15 Sounds Of The Seventies - 1974 Take Two
: Clean intro (I assume this is the 45 version)
Warner Archives/Rhino 74375 The Complete Greatest Hits:
Cross-faded intro

Can anyone with the 45 comment on whether the 45 has a
clean intro?

Edited by Roscoe

eriejwg

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Posted: 21 June 2010 at 6:53pm

I noticed that too, Roscoe. You may be on to something.

Yah Shure

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Posted: 21 June 2010 at 8:29pm

Roscoe, the 45 did indeed have a clean intro (CORRECTION: not true; see Bill's post below.) America's Holiday vinyl LP had the instrumental track "Miniature" segue into "Tin Man." At the time, one of the four AM top-40 stations here in the Twin Cities always played the two tracks segued together, and never the single. I don't recall hearing anything other than the single on the other three stations, though.

Edited by Yah Shure

Bill Cahill View Drop Down

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Posted: 28 June 2010 at 7:34pm

My DJ 45 does NOT have a clean intro. Both the mono and stereo side have left over orchestration from the previous track like you hear on "Complete Greatest Hits". Maybe the stock copies are different or there was a second DJ copy, but my understanding was that the song was always that way on the 45, with a tiny bit of the orchestration from Miniature on the beginning, until George Martin remixed it for History, when it was taken off. My DJ 45 does not match History.

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Posted: 29 June 2010 at 4:34pm

History is a different animal here. The DJ 45 indeed doesn't have a clean intro. History, America's Greatest Hits is remixed.

I turn up the good and turn down the bad!

Yah Shure

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Posted: 30 June 2010 at 5:01am

Bill, you're right! I never noticed the difference before. I only have the DJ 45 and the Back To Back Hits reissue, and they're the same.

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Posted: 22 July 2010 at 12:15pm

ok, i'm confused. The database has been updated, with the non-segued
version indicated to be the 45 version (like as found on History). That is
different from what's reported here. I thought I had a 45 of this, but I don't.
We need to confirm...

dc1

Yah Shure

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Posted: 22 July 2010 at 12:54pm

David, History does not contain the 45 version. To reiterate what Bill stated above, the 45 was edited from the segue of "Miniature" and "Tin Man" that appeared on the Holiday LP. You can definitely hear the last remnants of "Miniature" over the opening bass and acoustic guitar strums of "Tin Man" on the 45.

The same opening bass and guitar strums on the History track are completely in the clear, with no carry-over from "Miniature" at all. This is probably how the 45 should have been done in the first place, but alas, it was not.

Edited by Yah Shure

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Posted: 22 July 2010 at 2:12pm

i believe you...and I can clearly hear the segue. My comment pertains to the
database...it now indicates History to be the 45 version, contrary to what is
stated here.

dc1

Author	Message Topic Search Topic Options Post Reply Create New Topic Printable Version Translate Topic
Roscoe Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Music Fan Joined: 18 July 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote Roscoe Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: America - "Tin Man" Posted: 21 June 2010 at 6:06pm
	I couldn't find any previous thread or a database notation on the song "Tin Man" by America, but I think there may be a 45 vs. LP difference. On the LP, some instrumentation from the outro of the previous track is cross-faded on the first 2.9 seconds of "Tin Man". Unfortunately, I don't have a 45 to compare to but I assume the 45 starts with a clean intro without the cross-fade. I only have this song on a couple of other CDs and can report the following: Time-Life SOD-15 Sounds Of The Seventies - 1974 Take Two : Clean intro (I assume this is the 45 version) Warner Archives/Rhino 74375 The Complete Greatest Hits: Cross-faded intro Can anyone with the 45 comment on whether the 45 has a clean intro? Edited by Roscoe

eriejwg Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Music Fan Joined: 10 June 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 123	Post Options Post Reply Quote eriejwg Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 21 June 2010 at 6:53pm
	I noticed that too, Roscoe. You may be on to something.

Yah Shure Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Music Fan Joined: 11 December 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1	Post Options Post Reply Quote Yah Shure Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 21 June 2010 at 8:29pm
	Roscoe, the 45 did indeed have a clean intro (CORRECTION: not true; see Bill's post below.) America's Holiday vinyl LP had the instrumental track "Miniature" segue into "Tin Man." At the time, one of the four AM top-40 stations here in the Twin Cities always played the two tracks segued together, and never the single. I don't recall hearing anything other than the single on the other three stations, though. Edited by Yah Shure

Bill Cahill Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Music Fan Joined: 27 June 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8	Post Options Post Reply Quote Bill Cahill Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 28 June 2010 at 7:34pm
	My DJ 45 does NOT have a clean intro. Both the mono and stereo side have left over orchestration from the previous track like you hear on "Complete Greatest Hits". Maybe the stock copies are different or there was a second DJ copy, but my understanding was that the song was always that way on the 45, with a tiny bit of the orchestration from Miniature on the beginning, until George Martin remixed it for History, when it was taken off. My DJ 45 does not match History.

KentT Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Music Fan Joined: 25 May 2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote KentT Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 29 June 2010 at 4:34pm
	History is a different animal here. The DJ 45 indeed doesn't have a clean intro. History, America's Greatest Hits is remixed.
	I turn up the good and turn down the bad!

Yah Shure Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Music Fan Joined: 11 December 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1	Post Options Post Reply Quote Yah Shure Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 30 June 2010 at 5:01am
	Bill, you're right! I never noticed the difference before. I only have the DJ 45 and the Back To Back Hits reissue, and they're the same.

davidclark Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Music Fan Joined: 17 November 2004 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 46	Post Options Post Reply Quote davidclark Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 July 2010 at 12:15pm
	ok, i'm confused. The database has been updated, with the non-segued version indicated to be the 45 version (like as found on History). That is different from what's reported here. I thought I had a 45 of this, but I don't. We need to confirm...
	dc1

Yah Shure Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Music Fan Joined: 11 December 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1	Post Options Post Reply Quote Yah Shure Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 July 2010 at 12:54pm
	David, History does not contain the 45 version. To reiterate what Bill stated above, the 45 was edited from the segue of "Miniature" and "Tin Man" that appeared on the Holiday LP. You can definitely hear the last remnants of "Miniature" over the opening bass and acoustic guitar strums of "Tin Man" on the 45. The same opening bass and guitar strums on the History track are completely in the clear, with no carry-over from "Miniature" at all. This is probably how the 45 should have been done in the first place, but alas, it was not. Edited by Yah Shure

davidclark Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Music Fan Joined: 17 November 2004 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 46	Post Options Post Reply Quote davidclark Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 22 July 2010 at 2:12pm
	i believe you...and I can clearly hear the segue. My comment pertains to the database...it now indicates History to be the 45 version, contrary to what is stated here.
	dc1