https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/ Copyright (c) 2006-2013 Web Wiz Forums - All Rights Reserved. Wed, 22 Apr 2026 15:58:51 +0000 Fri, 05 Oct 2012 11:36:59 +0000 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Web Wiz Forums 12.07 360 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/RSS_post_feed.asp?TID=7075 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum//images/Top-40-Music-on-CD-Forum-Logo.png https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/ https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35620&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35620 Author: Brian W.
Subject: 7075
Posted: 05 October 2012 at 11:36am

JL328 wrote: I understand the Taylor Swift songs charting. Those are promotional/countdown/buzz singles that are being released one at a time to create hype for Swift's upcoming album. There have been several other such countdown singles to chart over the last few years.

Often the "countdown" singles can re-chart later, too. Justin Bieber's current hit, "As Long as You Love Me," was a countdown single that is now a traditional hit. So was Taylor Swift's "Fearless" -- it was released as a countdown single with an all-graphic cover, in advance of the album, then later charted in its album version:



(By the way, I really like the term "countdown single." I've always wondered how to describe these things.) :) ]]> Fri, 05 Oct 2012 11:36:59 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35620&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35620 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35617&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35617 Author: aaronk
Subject: 7075
Posted: 04 October 2012 at 10:31pm

That's the beauty of iTunes. You don't have to buy the whole album. You can choose your favorites and make your own album.

Surely there will be several people who buy the whole album, but I'm sure there will be others that just pick a handful of songs.]]> Thu, 04 Oct 2012 22:31:24 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35617&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35617 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35615&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35615 Author: JL328
Subject: 7075
Posted: 04 October 2012 at 7:23pm

I understand the Taylor Swift songs charting. Those are
promotional/countdown/buzz singles that are being released one at a time
to create hype for Swift's upcoming album. There have been several other
such countdown singles to chart over the last few years.

But how are the Mumford & Sons songs charting? I don't understand why
people would be buying those songs individually rather than just buying the
album. ]]> Thu, 04 Oct 2012 19:23:53 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35615&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35615 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35613&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35613 Author: Paul Haney
Subject: 7075
Posted: 04 October 2012 at 1:10pm

The sales hits keep on comin'...Taylor Swift debuts at #7 on the Hot 100 with "Begin Again" and the new single "Red" is already #1 on iTunes and poised for a big debut next week.

Also, EVERY cut from the new Mumford & Sons album is either on the Hot 100 or Bubbling Under chart this week!]]> Thu, 04 Oct 2012 13:10:53 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35613&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35613 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35534&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35534 Author: EdisonLite
Subject: 7075
Posted: 26 September 2012 at 12:43am

aaronk wrote: I do still listen to a TON of current music.

I listen to current music as well, and always have. Even though I grew up in the '70s, even in the past decade I usually find 125+ current songs each year that I really like and want to add to my iPod and buy on CD. Granted, during some years, many of these songs are indie releases or major label flops or UK hits that weren't even released in the US but I do find a good 125+ current recordings every year. And while many of the songs are non-Billboard hits, THIS YEAR my overlap with the US top 10 has been the highest it's been since ... probably 1998 or 1999! I, too, agree with the assessments that pop music (as we knew it) - with strong melodies - is back again this year! And I hope it stays.]]> Wed, 26 Sep 2012 00:43:54 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35534&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35534 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35530&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35530 Author: aaronk
Subject: 7075
Posted: 25 September 2012 at 1:58pm

JL328 wrote: Now that I think about it, I guess what bothers me is that some day 25 years from now, I'll be looking through a Whitburn book and reminiscing over songs I've forgotten. I'll get to Taylor Swift and see "Jump Then Fall" and wonder whether I'm going senile because I can't remember a song that charted so high. I feel like I either want to know/remember this song (which is why I'm trying to compile the list) or it shouldn't have been in the Top 40 to begin with.

Yeah, I definitely see your point on this. But then again, one of the columns in the Whitburn book will tell you that the song only charted for a week or two total, and you'll know right away that this was one of those short-lived sales-based peakers.

This is also why I tend to look at both airplay and Hot 100 charts when I'm researching hits of the past.]]> Tue, 25 Sep 2012 13:58:16 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35530&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35530 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35528&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35528 Author: JL328
Subject: 7075
Posted: 25 September 2012 at 12:05pm

Hykker wrote: torcan wrote: I really don't think anything should chart unless it's intended to be a "single" - not just an album track people download for a week or two then it disappears. I see your point, and agree that these 1 or 2-week wonders do tend to clutter up the charts, but how do you keep track of what was "intended" to be a single? How would you handle legitimate hit songs that were never released as singles ("Stairway To Heaven", "Don't Speak", etc.)? In this age of digital downloads, there really isn't any such thing as a single anymore. aaronk wrote: My curiousity got the best of me, Mark, so I pulled the top 20 year-end airplay hits from 2002 to 2008. What I found interesting was how few of these songs get any airplay today...maybe 2 or 3 from any given year.

Maybe charting only songs that are released to radio is the answer?

Per my original posts, I've spent a little bit of time over the last few days compiling the list of songs I was talking about (thanks in huge part to some chart data that was sent to me by another board member) and there are dozens of these "one-week wonders" that I had forgotten about and/or never even heard of.

I don't have a problem with the lead singles that debut top 10 based on hype and then die away quickly because of radio indifference after everyone who wants the song has bought it ("Can't Be Tamed" by Miley Cyrus and several Kanye West singles come to mind as examples). I think this is a result of the ease of iTunes/Amazon--- in the past, if I was pumped about the new Bruce Springsteen album, it might take me a few weeks to get up and physically go to the record store to buy that lead single. In the meantime, I can hear it on the radio. Nowadays, if I want the lead track from the upcoming Kesha album, all I need is three seconds and $1.29-- there is no reason to wait. Hence, everybody who wants it buys it the week it comes out unless it gets heavy radio play and gains new fans. This really is a function of the way we now consume music.

So, I don't have a problem with those tracks. What I am trying to track are the songs that never were released to radio at all. These are the outliers--- the countdown singles, the live performances, the tv show songs. Although there are truly some lost gems in here, there is something off about these songs appearing on the Hot 100. I guess maybe it's because they're not released to radio but, as others have mentioned, history is littered with examples of album cuts that were very popular and could have/should have made the charts. Maybe the Hot 100 needs a threshold for spins and sales? That is, to chart a song must meet a minimum number of sales (downloads) and a minimum number of spins (like, say, 1)? That would eliminate the Glee songs, the Grammy performances, the "countdown" singles, the re-release album cuts, the charity singles, and the AI and Voice live performances.

Also, to address an earlier point... it was my understanding that BB only counts iTunes sales toward the Hot 100 if the individual song is purchased. In other words, if somebody buys the album or "completes" the album, those serve as sales for purposes of the BB 200 but do not help the individual songs for purposes of the Hot 100. Is that right???

With respect to Taylor Swift, I think she had all those Hot 100 hits by virtue of different people buying the individual tracks. For example, she released deluxe, platinum, etc. editions of both Fearless and Speak Now. Well, everybody already had those albums, so nobody "bought" or "completed" the deluxe/platinum editions--- rather, they just needed to buy the new tracks, which they did. So, since those tracks were purchased individually (as opposed to part of the album), those sales all counted toward the BB Hot 100 even though these were all album tracks that would never see the light of radio. I'm sure Taylor's people knew what they were doing and the way they structured the releaseof the deluxe editions guaranteed that people would buy the songs individually and get them into the Top 40 for one week before disappearing into the ether.

Now that I think about it, I guess what bothers me is that some day 25 years from now, I'll be looking through a Whitburn book and reminiscing over songs I've forgotten. I'll get to Taylor Swift and see "Jump Then Fall" and wonder whether I'm going senile because I can't remember a song that charted so high. I feel like I either want to know/remember this song (which is why I'm trying to compile the list) or it shouldn't have been in the Top 40 to begin with.

Edited by JL328]]> Tue, 25 Sep 2012 12:05:42 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35528&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35528 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35476&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35476 Author: aaronk
Subject: 7075
Posted: 23 September 2012 at 7:11pm

Hykker wrote: What I found interesting was how few of these songs get any airplay today...maybe 2 or 3 from any given year.

That's true, but the CHR stations around here play very few songs older than about 6 months. Once in a while, I'll hear something from a year or two ago, but it's very infrequent. CHR would be about the only format that would really play any of those songs, and they just burn through the currents at 100 spins per week.]]> Sun, 23 Sep 2012 19:11:19 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35476&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35476 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35473&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35473 Author: Hykker
Subject: 7075
Posted: 23 September 2012 at 6:19pm

torcan wrote: I really don't think anything should chart unless it's intended to be a "single" - not just an album track people download for a week or two then it disappears.

I see your point, and agree that these 1 or 2-week wonders do tend to clutter up the charts, but how do you keep track of what was "intended" to be a single? How would you handle legitimate hit songs that were never released as singles ("Stairway To Heaven", "Don't Speak", etc.)?

In this age of digital downloads, there really isn't any such thing as a single anymore.

aaronk wrote: My curiousity got the best of me, Mark, so I pulled the top 20 year-end airplay hits from 2002 to 2008.

What I found interesting was how few of these songs get any airplay today...maybe 2 or 3 from any given year.


Edited by Hykker]]> Sun, 23 Sep 2012 18:19:23 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35473&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35473 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35435&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35435 Author: aaronk
Subject: 7075
Posted: 21 September 2012 at 10:22pm

My curiousity got the best of me, Mark, so I pulled the top 20 year-end airplay hits from 2002 to 2008. I have bolded the songs that I consider to be rap/hip-hop. (I don't consider R&B to fall into the same category as rap/hip-hop, so certainly there are a number of additional R&B songs that hit the pop chart. Also, there are a handful of songs that really are pop or R&B, even if the artist has traditionally performed hip-hop/rap.)

2002
1 Complicated Avril Lavigne 342 25 1
2 In The End Linkin Park 317 23 1
3 Dilemma Nelly w/ Kelly Rowland 313 21 1
4 A Thousand Miles Vanessa Carlton 288 23 1
5 Underneath It All No Doubt w/ Lady Saw 276 21 1
6 Lose Yourself Eminem 263 18 1
7 Don't Let Me Get Me Pink 262 20 1
8 Hot In Herre Nelly 258 19 1
9 Ain't It Funny Jennifer Lopez w/ Ja Rule & Cadillac Tah 244 20 1
10 Just Like A Pill Pink 239 18 2
11 Wherever You Will Go Calling 239 24 6
12 One Last Breath Creed 229 21 4
13 U Got It Bad Usher 228 18 3
14 Foolish Ashanti 227 17 2
15 Sk8er Boi Avril Lavigne 216 15 1
16 Without Me Eminem 216 17 1
17 All You Wanted Michelle Branch 216 20 2
18 Gotta Get Thru This Daniel Bedingfield 215 18 3
19 What's Luv Fat Joe w/ Ashanti 214 20 3
20 Hero Chad Kroeger w/ Josey Scott 212 17 2

2003
1 Here Without You 3 Doors Down 396 27 1
2 Where Is The Love Black Eyed Peas w/ Justin Timberlake 366 24 1
3 Hey Ya OutKast 324 22 1 (sung, not rapped, even though it's Outkast)
4 Bring Me To Life Evanescence w/ Paul McCoy 323 24 1
5 Miss Independent Kelly Clarkson 299 20 1
6 Shake Ya Tailfeather Nelly w/ P. Diddy & Murphy Lee 299 21 1
7 Rock Your Body Justin Timberlake 292 20 1
8 Unwell Matchbox Twenty 286 24 3
9 I'm With You Avril Lavigne 280 19 1
10 Ignition R. Kelly 278 20 1
11 Beautiful Christina Aguilera 274 19 1
12 When I'm Gone 3 Doors Down 274 23 1
13 Crazy In Love Beyonce w/ Jay-Z 272 18 1
14 In Da Club 50 Cent 267 19 1
15 Baby Boy Beyonce w/ Sean Paul 264 18 1
16 All I Have Jennifer Lopez w/ L.L. Cool J. 264 19 1
17 Can't Hold Us Down Christina Aguilera w/ Lil' Kim 225 17 3
18 Why Don't You & I Santana w/ Alex Band 221 21 3
19 Picture Kid Rock w/ Sheryl Crow 206 18 5
20 Get Busy Sean Paul 204 17 3

2004
1 Yeah Usher w/ Lil' Jon & Ludacris 385 31 1
2 The Reason Hoobastank 382 26 1
3 She Will Be Loved Maroon 5 343 24 1
4 This Love Maroon 5 341 25 1
5 Leave (Get Out) JoJo 318 22 1
6 Breakaway Kelly Clarkson 293 22 1
7 With You Jessica Simpson 286 21 1
8 The Way You Move OutKast w/ Sleepy Brown 284 20 1
9 Someday Nickelback 280 24 2
10 Pieces Of Me Ashlee Simpson 279 21 1
11 My Immortal Evanescence 278 22 2
12 Toxic Britney Spears 276 18 1
13 Over And Over Nelly w/ Tim McGraw 275 18 1
14 My Happy Ending Avril Lavigne 267 20 2
15 Suga Suga Baby Bash w/ Frankie J. 266 20 2
16 Burn Usher 249 17 2
17 Dip It Low Christina Milian w/ Fabolous 231 19 3
18 Naughty Girl Beyonce 216 16 2
19 Lose My Breath Destiny's Child 215 16 3
20 My Boo Usher w/ Alicia Keys 205 16 2

2005
1 Since U Been Gone Kelly Clarkson 431 28 1
2 Because Of You Kelly Clarkson 384 26 1
3 We Belong Together Mariah Carey 378 22 1
4 Behind These Hazel Eyes Kelly Clarkson 372 27 2
5 Run It Chris Brown w/ Juelz Santana 338 26 1
6 Boulevard Of Broken Dreams Green Day 307 22 1
7 1, 2 Step Ciara w/ Missy Elliott 288 20 1
8 You And Me Lifehouse 284 27 4
9 Photograph Nickelback 276 21 3
10 Don't Cha Pussycat Dolls w/ Busta Rhymes 273 24 3
11 Let Me Love You Mario 270 19 1
12 Pon De Replay Rihanna 269 20 2
13 Hollaback Girl Gwen Stefani 267 18 1
14 I Don't Want To Be Gavin DeGraw 264 23 1
15 Gold Digger Kanye West w/ Jamie Foxx 262 19 1
16 Let Me Go 3 Doors Down 253 24 2
17 Listen To Your Heart D.H.T. 248 18 1
18 Don't Phunk With My Heart Black Eyed Peas 246 19 3
19 Caught Up Usher 235 18 2
20 Shake It Off Mariah Carey 225 18 1

2006
1 Promiscuous Nelly Furtado w/ Timbaland 344 25 1
2 Far Away Nickelback 343 25 1
3 Hips Don't Lie Shakira w/ Wyclef Jean 325 22 1
4 Unwritten Natasha Bedingfield 324 26 2
5 Check On It Beyonce w/ Slim Thug 307 22 1
6 Buttons Pussycat Dolls w/ Snoop Dogg 302 24 1
7 My Love Justin Timberlake w/ T.I. 299 22 1
8 S.O.S. (Rescue Me) Rihanna 299 22 1
9 SexyBack Justin Timberlake w/ Timbaland 298 22 1
10 I Write Sins Not Tragedies Panic! At The Disco 298 24 2
11 Lips Of An Angel Hinder 297 22 1
12 Stickwitu Pussycat Dolls 295 20 1
13 Irreplaceable Beyonce 285 20 1
14 Temperature Sean Paul 284 21 1
15 How To Save A Life Fray 268 22 3
16 Too Little Too Late JoJo 254 21 2
17 Me & U Cassie 252 20 3
18 Walk Away Kelly Clarkson 248 23 5
19 Where'd You Go Fort Minor w/ Holly Brook 240 17 2
20 Over My Head (Cable Car) Fray 239 24 5

2007
1 Apologize Timbaland w/ OneRepublic 416 27 1
2 The Way I Are Timbaland w/ Keri Hilson 390 26 1
3 Big Girls Don't Cry Fergie 376 24 1
4 Say It Right Nelly Furtado 306 22 1
5 U + Ur Hand Pink 294 24 1
6 The Sweet Escape Gwen Stefani w/ Akon 286 22 2
7 Wait For You Elliott Yamin 282 23 4
8 What Goes Around Comes Around Justin Timberlake 278 19 1
9 Give It To Me Timbaland w/ Nelly Furtado & Justin Timberlake 277 23 3
10 Who Knew Pink 269 19 1
11 It's Not Over Daughtry 268 21 1
12 Glamorous Fergie w/ Ludacris 268 21 2
13 Cupid's Chokehold Gym Class Heroes w/ Patrick Stump 262 19 1
14 Summer Love Justin Timberlake 259 19 1
15 Makes Me Wonder Maroon 5 251 21 4
16 Umbrella Rihanna w/ Jay-Z 247 21 2
17 Stronger Kanye West 246 19 1
18 Hey There Delilah Plain White T's 244 19 2
19 Buy U A Drank (Shawty Snappin') T-Pain w/ Yung Joc 237 21 4
20 Hate That I Love You Rihanna w/ Ne-Yo 233 20 3

2008
1 Low Flo Rida w/ T-Pain 357 25 1
2 Leavin' Jesse McCartney 344 24 1
3 Bleeding Love Leona Lewis 343 22 1
4 Forever Chris Brown 317 24 1
5 Take A Bow Rihanna 298 22 1
6 No Air Jordin Sparks w/ Chris Brown 294 22 2
7 Hot N Cold Katy Perry 292 22 1
8 No One Alicia Keys 276 20 1
9 So What Pink 272 18 1
10 Disturbia Rihanna 267 22 1
11 Love Song Sara Bareilles 265 20 1
12 With You Chris Brown 260 19 1
13 Clumsy Fergie 254 20 2
14 Love In This Club Usher w/ Young Jeezy 254 19 2
15 Closer Ne-Yo 245 18 2
16 Let It Rock Kevin Rudolf w/ Lil' Wayne 228 26 6
17 Live Your Life T.I. w/ Rihanna 227 16 1
18 I Kissed A Girl Katy Perry 226 16 2
19 See You Again Miley Cyrus 225 20 4
20 Better In Time Leona Lewis 222 20 3

Edited by aaronk]]> Fri, 21 Sep 2012 22:22:02 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7075&PID=35435&title=nonradio-hits-and-promotional-singles#35435