https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/ Copyright (c) 2006-2013 Web Wiz Forums - All Rights Reserved. Wed, 22 Apr 2026 04:08:29 +0000 Mon, 13 Apr 2026 22:37:40 +0000 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Web Wiz Forums 12.07 360 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/RSS_post_feed.asp?TID=1859 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum//images/Top-40-Music-on-CD-Forum-Logo.png https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/ https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=68055&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#68055 Author: aaronk
Subject: 1859
Posted: 13 April 2026 at 10:37pm

Impressive research! I'll do what I can to sort out the database entries, but there are 119 CDs listed. Not an easy task :(]]> Mon, 13 Apr 2026 22:37:40 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=68055&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#68055 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=68053&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#68053 Author: mjb50
Subject: 1859
Posted: 13 April 2026 at 10:35am

Part 2 of my epic analysis (see previous message for part 1):

What Ron called the "previously unreleased edit" is what the database is calling "single version but slower than the single and missing the last :07 of the trumpet ending on the single", and this is also what the database is calling "alternate take". They are all the same mix, which LunarLaugh learned is in fact a Bill Inglot remix. The fade length varies quite a bit, with the longest fades longer than the 45 (I think) and the shortest ones missing like 9 seconds.

Therefore, I think the database should consistently refer to this version as something like "remix which is a failed attempt to re-create the single version in stereo". The reason why I say it failed is because, as was already pointed out, the 2nd half uses the previously unheard slow take.

As for it being slower than the retail 45, well, it's using the slow takes for both halves, so this makes sense. Until the 2nd half, the speed and content are actually the same as on the 45 and LP, which are using the same take. However, in the remix, the first half has slightly narrower stereo, there's extra reverb on the intro (creating what sounds like an unintentional "ping"), and, in most appearances, the channels are swapped throughout (the piano is erroneously on the left).

More database corrections:
• If the rip I found is right, The Hits... and Much More has the soundtrack version, not LP version.
• If the rip I found is right, The Very Best Of B.J. Thomas (Special Music 4827) is all vinyl transfers with extreme, crude noise reduction and terrible EQ.
• I'm uncertain whether it's correct that the LP version on 20 Greatest Hits was mastered from vinyl. It seems to me it's the same master shared by most CDs, so the note would need to apply to all of them. I think the background noise in certain parts can be explained as tape damage and splices making their way through.

Edited by mjb50 - 13 April 2026 at 10:36am]]> Mon, 13 Apr 2026 10:35:33 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=68053&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#68053 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=68052&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#68052 Author: mjb50
Subject: 1859
Posted: 13 April 2026 at 10:34am

Some supplemental notes, after much research of my own, Part 1:

They indeed recorded two takes: a slow one and a fast one. And yes, the released versions are assembled from different combinations of the 4 sections present in each take: Intro (to 0:04), 1st Half (to ~1:07), 2nd Half (to ~2:25), Outro.

Some features of the slow take: About 105.5 BPM, intro strummed harder, 1st half starts "Raindrops are" (more like "uh" than "are", actually), 2nd half starts with "Raindrops", outro starts with trumpet mistake.

Some features of the fast take: About 108 BPM, intro strummed softer, 1st half starts "Raindrops keep", 2nd half starts "uh-Raindrops", outro doesn't start with trumpet mistake.

The differences aren't just in vocals. Instruments are played and mixed slightly differently. For example, at 0:23 the strings fade up in the slow take, but drop in relatively suddenly in the fast one.

In the stereo versions, the piano should always be panned right.

So here are the official versions released in 1969:

• OST LP version: Slow intro, fast 1st half, fast 2nd half, slow outro. Bass panned wide. Intentionally mastered 2.0% fast.
• LP version: Slow intro, slow 1st half, fast 2nd half, slow outro.
• DJ 45 version: Fast take in its entirety. Mono fold-down. Mastered 0.6% faster than OST LP.
• 45 version: Slow intro, slow 1st half, fast 2nd half, fast outro. Mono fold-down. Mastered 0.9% faster than LP.

...The single version of “Raindrops” almost didn’t get released. “I actually did stop it from coming out,” Bacharach recalls. “It was set for release, but I turned down the pressing. I had been torn between two takes—one that sounded comfortable, one that had a lot of energy. I went with the comfortable one. But what I wound up doing was making an edit right in the middle of the song and picking up the fast one in the break. That’s how it was finally released.” (from a 2006 article in Performing Songwriter)

The retail 45 runtime is reported as 3:04 at the beginning of this thread, but AnotherProf's transfer runs 3:05 before it cuts off (although the bass drops out at 3:04.7). I can't tell if it was actually done fading out. I'm interested to hear other transfers.

Neither of the 45s is on CD. The DJ 45 is impossible to replicate with CD sources due to the unique intro. As already noted, the retail 45 can be reconstructed if you're willing to use Inglot's remix as a source for the outro. I would use the LP version for the rest.

The LP version is always sped up a little on CD, but the OST LP version is usually correct:
• LP version on CD: Usually 0.8% faster than the original LP. In one case (20 Greatest Hits 1990 CD) I found it was 1.2% fast. About half the time, the channels are swapped.
• OST version on CD: Usually exactly the same speed as the vinyl. Channel swaps are rare. Some remasters (1998–2001) seem to have the left channel volume boosted about 1 dB, which centers the bass better but makes the vocals a little off-center.

Re: 1969 as a release year even for the LP version, I researched that, too, and found pretty good evidence in Billboard and Cash Box that it was available in the last week or two of December 1969, despite many newer discographies saying it was a 1970 release.

An interesting mystery turned up in my research: one particular discography mentions that the very first pressings of the LP, with runout matrix codes ending in A and B, had a "muddy mix" (I wonder if they meant mastering?), whereas letters C and up sounded better. I'd be interested to hear these to see what they're talking about.

Edited by mjb50 - 13 April 2026 at 10:46am]]> Mon, 13 Apr 2026 10:34:41 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=68052&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#68052 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56430&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56430 Author: FrankG
Subject: 1859
Posted: 11 November 2020 at 5:24pm

I will say it again - you all are AMAZING. It's always
fascinating to read your detective work.]]> Wed, 11 Nov 2020 17:24:21 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56430&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56430 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56356&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56356 Author: C J Brown
Subject: 1859
Posted: 29 October 2020 at 3:52pm

yes very helpfull. Thanks again.]]> Thu, 29 Oct 2020 15:52:54 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56356&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56356 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56355&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56355 Author: LunarLaugh
Subject: 1859
Posted: 29 October 2020 at 1:54pm

If it helps, my copy of the disc was pressed at WEA in
Olyphant and has "W2387" followed by 3 R2 70752-2-05 in
the inner ring. ]]> Thu, 29 Oct 2020 13:54:41 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56355&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56355 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56336&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56336 Author: C J Brown
Subject: 1859
Posted: 27 October 2020 at 3:50pm

OK Lunar - sounds easy enough - thanks]]> Tue, 27 Oct 2020 15:50:19 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56336&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56336 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56330&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56330 Author: LunarLaugh
Subject: 1859
Posted: 26 October 2020 at 6:06pm

C J Brown wrote: How does anyone identify the proper Rhino B J Thomas Greatest Hits containing the Inglot stereo single remix of Raindrops Keep Falling?

On the reissue, the red oval Rhino logo on the spine
replaces the lettering version of the Rhino logo. ]]> Mon, 26 Oct 2020 18:06:41 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56330&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56330 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56328&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56328 Author: C J Brown
Subject: 1859
Posted: 26 October 2020 at 4:03pm

How does anyone identify the proper Rhino B J Thomas
Greatest Hits containing the Inglot stereo single remix of
Raindrops Keep Falling?

Edited by C J Brown]]> Mon, 26 Oct 2020 16:03:25 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56328&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56328 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56322&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56322 Author: LunarLaugh
Subject: 1859
Posted: 24 October 2020 at 3:39pm

AdvprosD wrote: LunarLaugh wrote: I have it from a reliable source that Bill Inglot digitally remixed "Raindrops..." in stereo to match the mono 45 specifically for the later pressing of the Rhino "Greatest Hits". The story relayed to me is that Bill and Ken Perry happened to be doing mastering at A&M when the staff tape librarian pulled the original 8 track multitrack for them to work from. Therefore, I'm not so sure the mono 45 could be a fold down of this stereo mix and I think it's more likely that the mono is an actual dedicated mix. I was just listening to a collection on the Rhino label from 2001: The Very Best of Burt Bacharach Rhino R276721 Produced by Bill Inglot. On this CD, they have a nice clean sounding version that doesn't sound quite the way I'm used to hearing it. (Raindrops Keep...) I think I read earlier that Bill Inglot did some work on a different Rhino set that was pulled from 8 track masters? Maybe this Bacharach collection has that version?

The Very Best of Burt Bacharach Rhino release is
essentially a single-disc overview of Rhino's "Look of
Love" box set. All the tracks that appear on it are
taken from said box set.

This Bachrach disc contains the original LP mix of
"Raindrops..." and not the slightly better sounding Bill
Inglot "stereo single" remix which appeared on later
pressings of Rhino's BJ Thomas "Greatest Hits".

Edited by LunarLaugh]]> Sat, 24 Oct 2020 15:39:59 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1859&PID=56322&title=b-j-thomas-raindrops-keep-fallin#56322