Top 40 Music on CD Forum : "Iko Iko" Belle Stars

"Iko Iko" Belle Stars : Gregg, thanks for your psycho-analysis...

Thu, 26 Nov 2015 09:32:38 +0000

Author: jimct
Subject: 1588
Posted: 26 November 2015 at 9:32am

Gregg, thanks for your psycho-analysis of my reply. I wasn't feeling even
one iota of "defensive" while typing it in. More like Jack Webb on
Dragnet - "just the facts", but it must be true, since I just read it on the
Internet - from you! Will you be sending me a bill for your professional
services? I'm WAY too busy these days to be concerned with my "inner
child", or any subconscious motivations that your radar somehow picked
up from my reply.

The way your first/second release statement read to me, you were stating
a sequential fact. Your typical posts do routinely delve deeply into
"current release mega-minutia". I enjoy reading them; you have a knack
for such detail, which I truly appreciate. I never recall you citing "for
descriptive purposes only" before. Interesting. Yet I'M the one who's being
defensive here...

For the umpteenth time, Gregg, I see you're up to your old tricks again -
passive-aggressive confrontation with me, and making things up out of
thin air. As always, I refuse to get tangled up in your spiderweb of
senseless, back-and-forth bickering, and will ignore any reply you make
to me here. You had a question, and "paged" me. I answered it, as quickly
and completely as possible. I've been asked to do the exact same thing
countless times before on this forum. Always my pleasure to help. Why
didn't you just say, "Thanks, Jim", like everyone else does?

Excuse me, kind sir. I have turkey and pie to eat, and loved ones to share
quality time with. Happy Thanksgiving to all! :)

Edited by jimct

"Iko Iko" Belle Stars : torcan wrote:The reason there...

Thu, 26 Nov 2015 02:40:48 +0000

Author: 80smusicfreak
Subject: 1588
Posted: 26 November 2015 at 2:40am

torcan wrote:

The reason there were two promo 45s is that in 1989, Capitol was one of the first labels to start releasing 45s promo-only. Between '89 and '91 there were over 50 and they all started with the 7PRO- no.

Sometimes they'd intend to release one promo-only then change their minds and release it commercially - then you'd get the regular no. which at that time would be 44xxx.

"Iko Iko" did come out commercially, and there's also a Beastle Boys single from the same year where this was the case - but most of the others in the 7PRO series never came out commercially.

That was going to be my next question - WHY two different-numbered promo 45s w/ the same version then??? Thanks for the explanation! :-)

"Iko Iko" Belle Stars : jimct wrote:Your first/second...

Thu, 26 Nov 2015 02:36:55 +0000

Author: 80smusicfreak
Subject: 1588
Posted: 26 November 2015 at 2:36am

jimct wrote:

Your first/second notations are wrong, however...

Actually, I never stated which one I thought was issued first, as I did not know; my use of the words "first" and "second" above were for descriptive purposes only...

Bottom line: the musical contents of both of my Capitol promo 45s are 100% identical, despite the two different promo 45 inventory numbers existing. So the promo 45 dub I passed along years ago for analysis, earlier in this thread, does still accurately represent the contents of both "iko Iko" Capitol promo 45s..

Hey, no need to get defensive. :-) You NEVER stated in your original posts from 2006-07 above that two different U.S. promo 45s for "Iko Iko" existed, so when I discovered that on Discogs, I felt it was worth pointing out here. Not to mention that I know you're a completist when it comes to promo 45s, so if you were missing/unaware of one of them, you'd surely want to track the other down, and hopefully report its contents here - that was why I picked you to call out at the end of my post. And hasn't obtaining complete promo & commercial 45 info always been a big part of what Pat's db and this forum are all about??? Geez, if it'll make you happy, going forward I'll pass on reporting any U.S. 45 pressing variants that haven't been documented here (commercial or promo), despite my numerous previous contributions in that area over my ten years here (David Naughton, Spanish-language versions, etc.)...

Thanks for the info, though...

"Iko Iko" Belle Stars : The reason there were two promo...

Wed, 25 Nov 2015 15:17:24 +0000

Author: torcan
Subject: 1588
Posted: 25 November 2015 at 3:17pm

The reason there were two promo 45s is that in 1989, Capitol was one of the first labels to start releasing 45s promo-only. Between '89 and '91 there were over 50 and they all started with the 7PRO- no.

Sometimes they'd intend to release one promo-only then change their minds and release it commercially - then you'd get the regular no. which at that time would be 44xxx.

"Iko Iko" did come out commercially, and there's also a Beastle Boys single from the same year where this was the case - but most of the others in the 7PRO series never came out commercially.

"Iko Iko" Belle Stars : Gregg, my station was sent/I currently...

Tue, 24 Nov 2015 04:51:00 +0000

Author: jimct
Subject: 1588
Posted: 24 November 2015 at 4:51am

Gregg, my station was sent/I currently own copies of both promo 45s you
just provided Discogs scans for. I just pulled them for you. Your
first/second notations are wrong, however, as it was the 7PRO-79543
promo 45 issued first. (Deadwax for both sides are identical: "7PRO-
79543 G-1", followed by a Q-shaped, stamped imprint (likely indicative
of a specific pressing plant). then "R-22433-G1" and "triangle 23998").

The P-B-44343, 2nd-issued U.S promo 45 also has the exact same
deadwax info on both sides of it. And, with one key exception, they are
100% identical to the 7PRO-79543 promo 45's deadwax details. Except
this one has "scratched off" the "7PRO-79543" part, and added "B-1-
44343" just to its left.

Bottom line: the musical contents of both of my Capitol promo 45s are
100% identical, despite the two different promo 45 inventory numbers
existing. So the promo 45 dub I passed along years ago for analysis,
earlier in this thread, does still accurately represent the contents of both
"iko Iko" Capitol promo 45s..

"Iko Iko" Belle Stars : EdisonLite wrote:Is it possible...

Mon, 23 Nov 2015 23:07:47 +0000

Author: 80smusicfreak
Subject: 1588
Posted: 23 November 2015 at 11:07pm

EdisonLite wrote:

Is it possible there were 2 different US singles of this (that look identical on the 45 label but have different matrix numbers printed on the wax)?

Hmmm, well, just to add to this discussion, while looking up "Iko Iko" on Discogs, I noticed there were, in fact, TWO different promo 45s issued for this single here in the U.S. in 1989, anyway (don't know about commercial). Pages, complete w/ photos:

THE BELLE STARS - "Iko Iko" (first U.S. promo 45)
THE BELLE STARS - "Iko Iko" (second U.S. promo 45)

The first one above is on Capitol P-B-44343, which matches the commercial single. The second had its own unique promo no., on Capitol 7PRO-79543. Both have white labels and a printed time of "2:49". I don't know if the versions appearing on them differ, though (don't own either myself). Calling jimct!!! :-)

Edited by 80smusicfreak

"Iko Iko" Belle Stars : Mark asked me about "Iko...

Mon, 23 Nov 2015 20:32:21 +0000

Author: crapfromthepast
Subject: 1588
Posted: 23 November 2015 at 8:32pm

Mark asked me about "Iko Iko", so I thought I'd post my findings here.

The 45 version from 1989 is the hit version that I assume all of us are looking for. It was the same version that was included on the Rain Man soundtrack, and both were on Capitol. There was no full-length Belle Stars album to accompany the Capitol 45; this was a soundtrack-only song.

The 45 version runs 104.2 BPM throughout on the Rain Man soundtrack, with no visible edits, and no tempo drifts.

The version on Varese's Totally Oldies Vol. 5 Then '80s (2003) is closer to the 45 than I initially thought, but is still different. The boingy intro is different (Mark figured out where this came from; see below.) Unfortunately, the 1989 version can't be recreated from this version because of the intro. The Varese version matches up with the 1989 version beginning at the first cowbell sound (2.9 seconds in on the 1989 version, 1.4 seconds in on the Varese version). They match up until 2:09, where the Varese version includes a very obvious-sounding edit to loop a different portion of the song. The Varese version also has another edit at 2:25. So, the endings are different as well.

The Varese version runs 104.5 BPM until 0:22, and 104.2 BPM after 0:22, with the edits at 2:09 and 2:25. It's about 3 dB louder than the Rain Man soundtrack, with a significantly brighter EQ and a little added compression/limiting.

The Belle Stars originally released the song in 1982 on Stiff in the UK (45+LP) and on Warner Bros. in the US (just LP). I have the US LP version, but not the UK versions - I don't know if the UK 45 is different from the UK LP, or if either differs from the US. My WB copy of the US LP runs about 3.0% faster than the 1989 version. To my ears, it sounds like the same backing track as the 1989 version, but with a different lead vocal track. I sent a copy to Mark to confirm.

Mark discovered that the boingy intro on the Varese disc matches the boingy intro on the 1982 version. After you slow the US WB version down to match the 1989 version, the US WB version also has edits at 2:09 and 2:26, in the same places as the Varese disc. The Varese disc fades about 15 seconds before the US WB version.

So it looks like the Varese disc has the same song structure/backing track as the US WB version but fades earlier, has the same tempo as the 1989 version (about 3.0% slower than the WB), and somehow includes the same lead vocal as the 1989 version.

Edited by crapfromthepast

"Iko Iko" Belle Stars : Sounds like this may well be a...

Fri, 05 Jan 2007 22:31:44 +0000

Author: Todd Ireland
Subject: 1588
Posted: 05 January 2007 at 10:31pm

Sounds like this may well be a case where the box Capitol sent to Varese was either mis-labeled or the wrong master tape was stored inside, and Varese never checked the tape against the 45. At any rate, this message thread prompted me to go out and pick up a copy of the Rain Man CD soundtrack and thus I now have the correct hit mix!

"Iko Iko" Belle Stars : EdisonLite wrote:With the help...

Fri, 05 Jan 2007 21:26:50 +0000

Author: jimct
Subject: 1588
Posted: 05 January 2007 at 9:26pm

EdisonLite wrote:

With the help of Jim, I compared the actual WB 1989 45 with the version on the "Rain Man" soundtrack CD and they are identical (other than the fact that the left and right channels have been reversed.)

Even though the Belle Stars' original early 80s recordings were on WB, Gordon, ALL "Iko Iko" 1989 commercial and promo 45s were issued on Capitol, including the mp3 dub I sent you earlier. Capitol was also the label that issued the original movie soundtrack. So, you've already heard the exact source that Bill P. said he thought his mastered CD version was taken from.

"Iko Iko" Belle Stars : I just told Bill about the comments...

Fri, 05 Jan 2007 20:58:06 +0000

Author: EdisonLite
Subject: 1588
Posted: 05 January 2007 at 8:58pm

I just told Bill about the comments on this board (i.e. the single mix is the same as the album mix) and he responded:

Can anyone look into this?