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995wlol
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| Posted: 03 February 2023 at 1:24pm | IP Logged
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I got my first CD player for high school graduation in
1994, but didn't take long for me to realize that many of
the CD albums I was buying lacked the "correct" version
of the songs I heard on the radio during the 80s. This
started my pursuit of greatest hits and VA compilations
to find those elusive "hit" versions. It wasn't long
before I bought a turntable so I could at least listen to
those versions on vinyl that I couldn't find on CD. Of
course, this wasn't as convenient as CD. Not to mention I
couldn't mix in those 45s the way I could program CDs on
my 5-disc changer.
Things started to change in the late 90s when I began
ripping CDs and converting vinyl to MP3 on my PC, which I
hooked up to my stereo. Finally, I could have all of my
music available in a single "jukebox". Even so, I was
working with a low quality turntable, so having a song on
CD was still preferable to vinyl in most cases.
However, over the last 20+ years, between upgrading my
vinyl setup, the introduction of easy-to-use noise-
removal software, and upgrading my files to FLAC, the
majority of my needle drops now meet (or sometimes
exceed) the quality my CDs. I've actually replaced many
brickwalled and digitally-futz-with CD versions with
vinyl transfers. While it's still nice to discover a
well-mastered 45 version on CD, it just isn't as
important to me as it once was if there's a quality vinyl
option available.
Wondering if anyone else has followed a similar path over
time?
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mjb50
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| Posted: 03 February 2023 at 4:08pm | IP Logged
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Yes, absolutely, when you find you have 5, 10, or 25 copies of the same song on various releases, you can't help but start comparing them, and you gain an appreciation for how much work goes into the transfers and mastering, and how "sound quality" is about more than just the technical capabilities of the format. A good vinyl mastering, transferred well, with very judicious use of noise reduction, can easily outperform a crappy CD mastering, despite CD being the more technically capable format. That said, most of the time, I either prefer CD, or it's toss-up.
When processing my own vinyl transfers, I am always trying not to idealize things too much. There's a balance to be struck between the raw needledrop (which include peculiarities of your playback system), and what we think it was supposed to sound like as a record (undoing some of those changes), what it was supposed to sound like on master tapes (mitigating some changes made in the vinyl mastering process), and just whatever we think sounds good today vs. in the past. It's very easy to overdo it!
Edited by mjb50 on 04 February 2023 at 12:03am
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Yah Shure
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| Posted: 04 February 2023 at 1:04pm | IP Logged
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That path is pretty well worn! I do a weekly show on what was once one of the Storz top-40 stations, and among its features is a top 20 countdown based on one of the station's original record surveys from the '60s and '70s. One of the major selling points of the show is playing as much original vinyl as possible, and my goal is to have each song sound just as it did when it was originally a hit on the station.
There have been many instances where I've gone with a vinyl dub over a CD option, either because it's truer to (or is) the original mono mix or it just plain sounds better. The opposite also does happen, when it's abundantly clear that the CD came from a lower generation source, but that's still the exception, rather than the rule.
Pointing out album vs. single differences, as we do here on the board, has also sharpened listeners' ears, as noted by this Facebook poster after I played the mono vinyl (okay, styrene) 45 on the show:
I've heard "Like A Rolling Stone" a million times, but as we listened to the show in our hot tub via my phone and a Bluetooth speaker, I couldn't believe how loud the tambourine was. I don't think I even noticed tambourine on the recording before! Just listened on the same speaker to the YouTube official audio... tambourine is there, but doesn't leap out at you. Strange!
It's amazing what you can coax out of those grooves sometimes. Not even the same song from the original mono Bob Dylan's Greatest Hits LP made the tambourine "pop" like the 45 did.
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LunarLaugh
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| Posted: 05 February 2023 at 11:55am | IP Logged
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It all gets into balancing nostalgia and authenticity with quality and technology.
Older popular recordings, particularly those made in the 1960s, were typically made with only the limitations of vinyl in
mind. Singles were mixed to sound good on transistor radios just as today's singles are mixed to sound good on air pods and
Amazon Echo units.
I don't think there is any right or wrong answer across the board. Vinyl has its drawbacks to be reckoned with (eg. surface
noise, groove wear, distortion, sibilance, off-center pressings) while digital tends to be more plug-and-play friendly.
I personally have a decently sized vinyl collection alongside a huge CD collection. That's because I was never all in on
digital downloads or streaming.
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Hykker
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| Posted: 06 February 2023 at 5:41am | IP Logged
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Good points Lunar.
I embraced CDs when they came out, though I waited until they were well-established ('87-88 or so) to do so and never went all-in replacing
perfectly good vinyl just for the sake of replacing it. Likewise digital downloads for current releases...I had a newmusicserver.com account
when I was still working in radio, though it has since lapsed. I've digitized much of my collection, and find it way more convenient.
The one thing I don't have much interest in is streaming. Other than occasionally listening to a non-local radio station I just don't see
the appeal. I can put together my own mixes that (1) sound better and (2) are just songs I like.
I really don't get the Great Vinyl Revival™, other than nostalgia for some of us older guys (I'm 72) I don't see any upside to it. I've
thinned out my LP collection by about 40% over the last few years. Not ready to part with any of my 45s though.
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995wlol
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| Posted: 06 February 2023 at 8:21pm | IP Logged
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Great feedback from everyone! One thing I'll add to my original sentiments: even back when I was still all-in on getting as much music as possible on CD, the one genre I always preferred on vinyl were 12" mixes. Maybe it was the fact that vinyl remained the primary format for club DJs well into the CD era, or the fact that many of those 12 inchers just sounded so good, but vinyl always seemed like the "right" format for that style of music.
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eriejwg
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| Posted: 07 February 2023 at 7:31am | IP Logged
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I didn't start collecting vinyl 45's again until 2007
when I discovered an internet interview with Jim Abbott
(RIP) who was a vital part of this forum for many years.
That interview made me realize that many songs I had in
my library were LP versions vs. 45 versions and I wanted
to replace them with 45 versions which led me here. I
bought a Technics 1200 turntable (after a short run with
an Audio- Technica turntable) and began to dub 45's which
weren't available digitally. Since then, I've recreated
many 45 versions and discovered through the database
which CD's have 45 versions. I also discovered Qobuz
which allows me to purchase lossless files. I've shifted
more away from vinyl and look for 45 versions digitally
these days, purchasing a CD only if it's not available to
purchase on Qobuz.
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AutumnAarilyn
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| Posted: 07 February 2023 at 5:59pm | IP Logged
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I've never run out of cds to buy as I also like jazz.
I never liked albums on vinyl but singles (45's) were
okay but many were styrene. There was a big quality
difference between the better sounding Warner 45's and
RCA's 45's. RCA's labels even turned white.
I also collect some gray market stuff on cd (live jazz
concerts, vinyl masterpiece compilations, etc.)
I dropped a grand just to get a couple Madonna single
versions on that Japanese box set. The tough part was
finding a US seller so I didn't have to pay customs in
addition to already paid sales tax.
Cds in various forms (3", standard 5"), box sets, singles
various artist compilations, gray market, high quality
bootleg all abound in my collection. I started 27 years
ago and don't have any regrets. Now I'm building a barn
dominium to put them in and buying small collections to
resell focusing on cd with vinyl is clean and cheap.
Edited by AutumnAarilyn on 07 February 2023 at 6:05pm
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Hykker
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| Posted: 08 February 2023 at 6:31am | IP Logged
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AutumnAarilyn wrote:
I never liked albums on vinyl but singles (45's) were
okay but many were styrene. There was a big quality
difference between the better sounding Warner 45's and
RCA's 45's. RCA's labels even turned white.
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But not all styrene sounded bad, nor did all vinyl sound good. Most labels used regional pressing plants, and
quality of pressings could vary considerably from one plant to another.
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NightAire
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| Posted: 08 February 2023 at 4:50pm | IP Logged
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My understanding was that styrene sounded OK... for ONE playing.
By the second playing, they started deteriorating, as I understand.
Those with more first-hand experience will clarify if I am wrong.
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Hykker
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| Posted: 09 February 2023 at 6:21am | IP Logged
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NightAire wrote:
My understanding was that styrene sounded OK... for ONE playing.
By the second playing, they started deteriorating, as I understand. |
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A bit of an exaggeration, and again it depends on the quality of the material used. I'm an east coast guy, so I don't have a
lot of experience with Monarch pressings, but I've heard that they sound very good. Most A&M singles in the 70s were on styrene
and they sounded good too. Columbia 45s kind of fit your description...first couple plays were OK, but they wore quickly.
OTOH, a lot of stuff that was pressed on vinyl sounds like crap. Most any Capitol 45 from the 70s is a popfest, as were many
RCA singles of that era and let's not even get going on Dunhill/ABC or Motown.
Edited by Hykker on 09 February 2023 at 6:23am
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Top 40 Music on Compact Disc : Chat Board
Topic: OT - Importance of CD/digital vs vinyl
