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RoknRobnLoxley
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Posted: 29 March 2020 at 3:48am | IP Logged Quote RoknRobnLoxley

PopArchivist wrote:
aaronk wrote:
I definitely understand your point, Rich, but “All At Once” certainly
would’ve been included with the [AIR] symbol next to the appropriate
peak position had it charted on the Hot 100 Airplay chart, right? That’s
all I was trying to confirm.


Understood. I dont have access to the airplay 1985-1986 charts so I would not know. Paul might...

Have you tried looking at individual Billboard issues for the Hot 100 Airplay charts? Check out this site:

https://www.americanradiohistory.com/Billboard-Magazine.htm

Edited by RoknRobnLoxley on 29 March 2020 at 3:55am
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Paul Haney
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Posted: 29 March 2020 at 4:12am | IP Logged Quote Paul Haney

RoknRobnLoxley wrote:
PopArchivist wrote:

aaronk wrote:
I definitely understand your point, Rich,
but “All At Once” certainly
would’ve been included with the [AIR] symbol next to the
appropriate
peak position had it charted on the Hot 100 Airplay
chart, right? That’s
all I was trying to confirm.


Understood. I dont have access to the airplay 1985-1986
charts so I would not know. Paul might...

Have you tried looking at individual Billboard issues for
the Hot 100 Airplay charts? Check out this site:

Magazine.htm">https://www.americanradiohistory.com/Billboa
rd-Magazine.htm


Really no need for that. Aaron is correct. If a song
made the Hot 100 Airplay chart, then it's in with the
artist's regular listings.

The "non Hot 100 classics" is a separate issue entirely.
The initial idea was to include songs that were
ineligible for the Hot 100, but eventually became
"classics" (example: "Stairway To Heaven" by Led
Zeppelin). This idea quickly mushroomed into including a
whole host of non-charted songs that both Joel and I felt
should be included. Yes, it's a subjective thing, and
just about every music fan could come up with their own
list. We did add every #1 hit from another singles chart
(R&B, Country, A/C, etc.) and any song that got a major
industry award, but we feel that there are more than
enough of the others to give a good representation. Yes,
"All At Once" got some airplay, but not enough to make
the AC chart and "Miles Away" didn't even get enough
airplay to "Bubble Under", so there's that. At the end
of the day, it's Joel's book and he makes the final
decision on what's included, as far as that category
goes!

PS: "Miles Away" by Madonna did hit #1 on the Hot 100
Sales chart, but then again it often only took a few
hundred units sold to do that in any given week, so it
was really not that difficult a feat.

Edited by Paul Haney on 29 March 2020 at 4:21am
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cmmmbase
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Posted: 29 March 2020 at 5:56am | IP Logged Quote cmmmbase

For what it's worth, All At Once spent 4 weeks in the
significant action column of Radio & Records' CHR chart
in July of 1986, but never got more than 25 reporting
stations.

Edited by cmmmbase on 30 March 2020 at 8:54am
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jebsib
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Posted: 29 March 2020 at 6:48am | IP Logged Quote jebsib

All at Once DID chart.

R&R AC chart - #23 on 8/8/86.
It was an album cut, ineligible for BB's AC charts at the time.
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Paul Haney
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Posted: 29 March 2020 at 10:08am | IP Logged Quote Paul Haney

jebsib wrote:
All at Once DID chart.

R&R AC chart - #23 on 8/8/86.
It was an album cut, ineligible for BB's AC charts at the
time.


Interesting! It also peaked at #23 on the Gavin Report AC
chart on August 29, 1986.

That's at least some amount of airplay, but I'd hardly
call it a classic.
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PopArchivist
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Posted: 29 March 2020 at 10:22am | IP Logged Quote PopArchivist

Paul Haney wrote:
That's at least some amount of airplay, but I'd hardly call it a classic.


Like you said Paul, it's subjective. It's considered one of Whitney's classic hits, included on her Greatest Hits, and on Disc 2 of the Best of Compilation Deluxe Edition and off her 1985 self titled album. While it may not be Stairway to Heaven it deserves some consideration. That's why I asked if you had a system or some ranking to determine if it was a Non-Hot 100 Classic.

As far as the Madonna track you might have a better argument, but it did get radio airplay here in New York and was released as a CD Single. Not only that it's one of the better tracks off her 2008 album. I can see the argument for not including it as stronger then the Whitney Houston track though.

But if the whole point is to be subjective, what does Joel lose by including one or both? Personally I think both stand on their own. I guess you have to draw a line somewhere....





Edited by PopArchivist on 29 March 2020 at 10:23am


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jebsib
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Posted: 29 March 2020 at 11:29am | IP Logged Quote jebsib

I have never heard Miles Away on any radio station, but heard AAO on various
(AC) stations around the country in the late 80s. There was also a Chart Beat
column by Paul Grein back in 1986 or 87 suggesting that All at Once was
considered as a 5th WH single but it was cancelled as they wanted her #1
string intact for the Whitney LP roll-out.
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Paul C
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Posted: 29 March 2020 at 2:39pm | IP Logged Quote Paul C

Paul, both Pop Hits Singles & Albums 1940-1954 and its 1994
predecessor indicate that Dinah Shore’s version of “Bibbidi-Bobbidi-
Boo” charted for one week at #25 on the Best Sellers chart. It actually
spent the lone week that it charted on the Disc Jockey chart.

As for “All At Once”, bear in mind that the Billboard airplay chart at the
time was based on reported airplay. Since I don’t believe Arista ever
actively promoted the song, there were likely more stations playing it
than were actually reporting that they were playing it.
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Paul Haney
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Posted: 30 March 2020 at 3:53am | IP Logged Quote Paul Haney

Thank you, Paul C! I made that Dinah Shore correction to
our database.
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Chartman
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Posted: 06 April 2020 at 12:15pm | IP Logged Quote Chartman

Paul Haney wrote:

We've also started work on an updated Rock Tracks
(Mainstream/Alternative) book.


Good to hear about this. A long time ago I sent you some corrections for the 2008 book (all were carry overs from the first edition - before your time) so I'm not sure if you ever updated your database.

They are in a excel format you can grab here:
https://ufile.io/z5xjtpyl
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thecdguy
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Posted: 07 April 2020 at 6:07am | IP Logged Quote thecdguy

How about the Adult songs book, has there been any talk of updating it? Last edition I know of ran up to 2006.

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Paul Haney
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Posted: 07 April 2020 at 7:00am | IP Logged Quote Paul Haney

thecdguy wrote:
How about the Adult songs book, has
there been any talk of updating it? Last edition I know of
ran up to 2006.


We had to decide between Rock Tracks and Adult. Rock
Tracks is a better seller, so we went with that. However,
an Adult update may be in the cards next year.
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Paul Haney
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Posted: 07 April 2020 at 7:07am | IP Logged Quote Paul Haney

Chartman wrote:
Paul Haney wrote:

We've also started work on an updated Rock Tracks
(Mainstream/Alternative) book.


Good to hear about this. A long time ago I sent you some
corrections for the 2008 book (all were carry overs from
the first edition - before your time) so I'm not sure if
you ever updated your database.

They are in a excel format you can grab here:
https://ufile.io/z5xjtpyl


I made those corrections awhile ago. Thanks again!
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Scanner
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Posted: 07 April 2020 at 7:24am | IP Logged Quote Scanner

Great to hear the Adult book may be updated finally.
I would love to see the book's research expanded to
include peaks in R&R (1973-2006) and Record World
(1967-1972, 1980-1982). (Of course, R&R and Billboard
were the same from 2006 until R&R's end in 2009.)

There were some interesting disparities among the
publications. R&R's AC chart was initially more Pop
than Billboard's. Even when the R&R chart became more
mellow, there were still some major differences
between the two like Billboard Number Ones by Al
Stewart ("Time Passages" - 10 weeks) and Maxine
Nightingale ("Lead Me On" - 7 weeks) both only peaking
at No. 2 in R&R. Of course, the charts really
diverged in the mid-90's when R&R was the first to
split the AC and Hot AC charts. Many R&R AC hits
never charted in Billboard since those songs did not
have any or sufficient Hot AC airplay.
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Scanner
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Posted: 07 April 2020 at 10:03am | IP Logged Quote Scanner

Record World's 1980's AC chart leaned more Pop as well.
"Bette Davis Eyes" went to No. 1 AC in Record World, but
only No. 7 in R&R and No. 15 in Billboard. Rocky
Burnette's "Tired Of Toein' The Line" was No. 11 in
Record World, No. 20 in R&R and No. 39 in Billboard.
Songs like Irene Cara's "Fame" (No. 28 RW) and Donna
Summer's "The Wanderer" (No. 39 RW) missed both the
Billboard and R&R charts. Dionne Warwick's ballad "No
Night So Long" spent three weeks at No. 1 in Billboard
and reached No. 3 in R&R, but only climbed to No. 10 in
Record World.
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torcan
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Posted: 10 April 2020 at 12:27pm | IP Logged Quote torcan

Paul Haney wrote:

As far as other projects in the works, we are just about
finished scanning the 1980s Cash Box Top 100 charts.


That would definitely be of interest!
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aaronk
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Posted: 11 April 2020 at 9:08pm | IP Logged Quote aaronk

As I was going through some records, I came across a copy of "Saving All My Love For You" b/w "All At Once," and a Post-It note on the record, courtesy of jimct, says "KC 101 - All At Once." This prompted me to browse the ARSA database, and sure enough, "All At Once" was a pretty big hit for New Haven, CT. Here's the top 10 from the survey where it peaked at #4:

***KC101 MUSIC SURVEY FOR JULY 25, 1986***
1. Peter Gabriel - Sledgehammer
2. Peter Cetera - Glory Of Love
3. Janet Jackson - Nasty
4. Whitney Houston - All At Once
5. Jermaine Stewart - We Don't Have To Take Our Clothes Off
6. Rod Stewart - Love Touch
7. Kenny Loggins - Danger Zone
8. Madonna - Papa Don't Preach
9. Bananarama - Venus
10. Genesis - Invisible Touch

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eriejwg
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Posted: 12 April 2020 at 1:03pm | IP Logged Quote eriejwg

We may have played All At Once at K104 in Erie PA but I
can't find any documentation online. Somewhere I have a
Top 104 of 1986 from K104 but I'd have to go searching.

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Scanner
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Posted: 13 April 2020 at 7:46am | IP Logged Quote Scanner

I still hear "All At Once" on the radio, but cannot tell
you the last time I heard some of her Number Ones like
"Where Do Broken Hearts Go," "All The Man That I Need"
or "Exhale (Shoop Shoop)."
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AutumnAarilyn
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Posted: 13 April 2020 at 7:06pm | IP Logged Quote AutumnAarilyn

Maybe there should be a chart based on current oldies
airplay. As time goes on, highest chart position in the
year of release becomes less and less relevant.
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