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abagon
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Posted: 03 September 2008 at 11:04pm | IP Logged Quote abagon

JOHN HUNTER - "Tragedy"

The actual commercial 45 running time is (3:45), the listed time is "3:48" on the record label. (Private ZS4 04643)
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EdisonLite
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Posted: 05 December 2011 at 6:15pm | IP Logged Quote EdisonLite

Does anyone have the John Hunter "Famous At Night" LP and can they tell me the timing of "Tragedy" on that? Was it longer than the single?
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Roscoe
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Posted: 05 December 2011 at 10:02pm | IP Logged Quote Roscoe

EdisonLite wrote:
Does anyone have the John Hunter
"Famous At Night" LP and can they tell me the timing of
"Tragedy" on that? Was it longer than the single?


The LP cut runs just under 3:46 on my turntable, so I would
say that the 45 and LP appear to be the same length.
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crapfromthepast
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Posted: 20 June 2012 at 11:04am | IP Logged Quote crapfromthepast

I found a version from a 45 that runs 4:13. It's the same as the 3:46 version until the 2:00 mark, then it's a different edit. It looks like the 3:46 version can be created from my 4:13 version with a little editing and an early fade.

I dubbed it myself from vinyl in January, 2002, and all my notes say is: "Taken from A-side of Private I 7-inch #ZS4 04643, 1984 (3:48)" So the printed time is way off.

I'd supply the matrix number, but the 45 has been buried in my basement and unseen by human eyes since January, 2002. Due to my ineffective filing system, I don't know if I have a commercial 45 or a promo 45.

Anyone know?

Edited by crapfromthepast on 30 August 2012 at 7:40am


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crapfromthepast
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Posted: 20 June 2012 at 11:20am | IP Logged Quote crapfromthepast

Ha! Just for kicks I checked the "H" section, and there it was, right next to my Human League singles. Alphabetization rules!

It's a commercial 45, with a bar code and everything. Matrix number ZS4-04643-3AF-1, and I played it to confirm that it does indeed run 4:13, even though it has a printed time of 3:48.

Edited by crapfromthepast on 30 August 2012 at 7:39am


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aaronk
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Posted: 20 June 2012 at 2:10pm | IP Logged Quote aaronk

Good find! I have dubs of the shorter commercial 45 and the LP, and they are the same 3:45 version.

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Jody Thornton
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Posted: 20 June 2012 at 2:52pm | IP Logged Quote Jody Thornton

crapfromthepast wrote:
Ha! Just for kicks I checked the "H" section, and there it
was, right next to my Human League singles.
Alphabetization rules!

It's a commercial 45, with a bar code and everything.
Matrix number ZS4-04643-3AF-1, and I played it to confirm
that it does indeed run 4:13, even though it has a printed
time of 3:48.


So what is it exactly? Does it simply have an extended second verse at 2:00?



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Q: What did one 45 say to the other?
A: Are you "single"?
:p
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cmmmbase
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Posted: 20 June 2012 at 4:25pm | IP Logged Quote cmmmbase

I have 2 copies. My promo - Matrix BA-ZS4-04643-3 runs 3:46. My Stock - Matrix BB-ZS4-04643-3 (with an 06 scratched out after the ZS4, but before the rest) also runs 3:46.
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aaronk
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Posted: 20 June 2012 at 6:51pm | IP Logged Quote aaronk

Yes, it's an extended verse. For the short version, they cut the verse in
half.

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MMathews
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Posted: 26 August 2012 at 12:39am | IP Logged Quote MMathews

Figured i'd add some info i noticed about the longer 45
version. (thanks, Ron for sending it!!) I happened to
notice a difference right in the intro, then i caught a
few others.

The longer version is at a faster pitch, and a different
mix. The bass track was completely re-cut for the
charting version of the song.
Oh, and...due to some "inside info" that a friend has, we
believe the longer version is the first one released.   
The shorter one's master is labeled as a remix, and it
is.   The vocal is drier, some very subtle mix
differences, runs slower, and as i said has a completely
different bass track re-cut for it.

When comparing them, the bass-notes on the intro of the
long version are a little different from each other, and
have a few "flubbed" notes. Also the "clap" sound is in
the center.
The shorter hit version, every bass note is identical
thru-out the intro, and the clap" is in the left channel.

Just thought i'd share that!
MM
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Jody Thornton
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Posted: 27 August 2012 at 2:51pm | IP Logged Quote Jody Thornton

Is there a way to hear the longer 45-rpm version? Ron? LOL
(I would like to hear it though)


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Q: What did one 45 say to the other?
A: Are you "single"?
:p
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MMathews
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Posted: 27 August 2012 at 5:19pm | IP Logged Quote MMathews

Hi guys...
i just forwarded the DL link to the "larger group" for
Jody and anyone else who missed it the first time.
enjoy. MM
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Roscoe
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Posted: 27 August 2012 at 5:44pm | IP Logged Quote Roscoe

MMathews wrote:
Hi guys...
i just forwarded the DL link to the "larger group" for
Jody and anyone else who missed it the first time.
enjoy. MM


Thanks. It was interesting to hear this version; their
remixing choices were wise even though the revised
version ultimately stalled in the lower reaches of the
top 40.

This song certainly deserved a better fate than its
lackluster chart position and decades of unavailability
on CD. Truly a "lost" 80s hit in every sense of the
word, yet it does seem to be fondly remembered by those
that were familiar with it. A CD release is almost
certainly a lost cause at this point, but perhaps an
iTunes release may be possible? I wonder who owns the
rights.

Edited by Roscoe on 27 August 2012 at 9:45pm
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Santi Paradoa
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Posted: 27 August 2012 at 8:35pm | IP Logged Quote Santi Paradoa

Who owns the rights? Good question. Was the Private I label
a part of a larger label? I can't remember any other artist
on that label (not the same as Private Stock). John Hunter
never hit the BB Hot 100 again even tho this single spent
four months riding the Hot 100 in late '84/early '85.

Edited by Santi Paradoa on 28 August 2012 at 3:56pm


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cmmmbase
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Posted: 27 August 2012 at 9:29pm | IP Logged Quote cmmmbase

Private I was a CBS label. Matthew Wilder, Staple Singers and LaToya Jackson all charted hits on the Hot 100/bubbling under the hot 100 (in the case of the Staple Singers) while on the label. It appears to have been absorbed in to the more generic label "CBS Associated" in 1986. John Hunter's second album appeared on this label.
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musicmanatl
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Posted: 28 August 2012 at 5:01am | IP Logged Quote musicmanatl

I've moved recently so I can't lay my hands on my copy of Frederic Dannen's book "Hit Men", but if I remember correctly, he said that Private I was a specialty label that Walter Yetnikoff gave to Michael Jackson's manager at that time, Frank Dileo. Dileo had been the promotions director for Epic from '79 to '84 or so. If you haven't read the book, it's a fascinating if disturbing portrayal of the underside of the music business.

I would imagine that Sony would own the masters for this label, but who knows, the way the music business goes.
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Santi Paradoa
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Posted: 28 August 2012 at 4:09pm | IP Logged Quote Santi Paradoa

I had forgotten about Matthew Wilder's "Break My Stride"
being on that same label. That must be the only 45 I have
on this label since I never bought John Hunter's "Tragedy"
or any of Matthew's other singles. I bet Sony would have
released this song by now if they had it (but like Frank
says who knows).

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mlyles
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Posted: 03 February 2018 at 6:44pm | IP Logged Quote mlyles

I purchased a cd of "Famous At Night" on eBay (seller
was from Estonia). It includes the original 10 songs
plus 6 bonus tracks. The album is listed on Discogs as
reissued on cd on CBS 39626 2. The CD, liners, etc. all
look legit. Does not sound like it was recorded from
vinyl. Anyway, I ripped Tragedy (3:48) from the cd. It
sounds great and noticeably louder than the version I
ripped from my vinyl 45. But, of course, the database
lists "Tragedy" as not on cd. Can anybody shed any
light on this? Thanks.   
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Santi Paradoa
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Posted: 03 February 2018 at 7:31pm | IP Logged Quote Santi Paradoa

Very interesting find. Does that CD have a US address on it anywhere?

Also, welcome to the board.

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mlyles
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Posted: 03 February 2018 at 7:58pm | IP Logged Quote mlyles

On the CD itself: This compilation *copyright symbol*
2013 SONY BMG Music Entertainment (EU) Limited.

On back insert: *copyright symbol* 1984 CBS Records Inc.
Printed in EU.
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